Hi Mike--
Thanks for taking time to share your comparisons with us. To study
them further, I took your quiet studio clips:
Telinga Clip-On Mics -> LS-10 (3.5mm mic input)
and
MKH40-30 -> 722
and matched them two ways: (1) without any EQ using RMS and (2) with
Low Hz Roll-Off (200 Hz 12dB/Octave) to account for the difference in
low-end responses and matched the room tone perceptually.
Then I took clips from urban ambience and again used Low Hz Roll-Off
(200 Hz 12dB/Octave) on both to account for the difference in low-end
response and matched them with RMS.
Below is a link to a QuickTime comparison movie for viewing with
QuickTime or MPEG Streamclip (Free, cross-platform
http://www.squared5.com/)
http://tinyurl.com/yewuxwe (13 mb QuickTime movie, download only)
A couple of things stand out to me:
One, the significant difference in noise performance one would
realize using the Telinga Clip-On -> LS-10 combination in a robust
setting like the urban one you provided compared to a much quieter
one where a lot of recorder gain is needed.
Two, we can't tell from this comparison how much of the noise stems
from the Telinga mic and how much stems from the LS-10's mic pre. I
do note that the noise does seems to be evenly spread across and low
into the audio spectrum which we've seen with the LS-10's mic pre.
(Sonogram of the first four clips with the Telinga->LS-10 combo in
the middle: http://tinyurl.com/ygktnr7 )
Someone with a M10, D50, PMD620 or Hi-MD recorder and the new
Telingas should be able to give us a sense of the self-noise
performance of Klas' new mics by making a comparison like yours and
running the low-noise reference mics on portable phantom power supply
and the Telingas on PIP.
Thanks again for sharing your explorations. Rob D.
=3D =3D =3D
At 7:17 PM +0000 3/24/10, walunit wrote:
>Hi folks,
>
>I received a set of Klas's new Telinga Clip-On omnis yesterday and
>tried a few experiments and compared a couple of configurations with
>my MKH M-S rig. Pardon the long post.
>
>First, I make no technical conclusions from these tests. I'm posting
>in the hopes that this is useful to the more technically inclined.
>Second, and on a more subjective note, these do not sound like
>"little" mics to me. I am pretty amazed at the Telinga + LS-10
>combo. I was seeking a reasonably priced, portable way to get into a
>fresh perspective in my soundscape recordings. With these omnis I
>can now start to experiment with various boundary techniques, etc.
>They sound great to my ears! I plan to take both rigs to the ocean
>next week and can share some more comparisons, etc., from that trip.
>
>Notes:
>The two setups are:
>1) Olympus LS-10 + Telinga Clip-Ons
>2) SD 722 + Sennheiser MKH 30/40 M-S mic setup
>
>All files were recorded 44.1 kHz and 24-bit. Both systems were set
>"flat" except whatever intrinsic filtering they may contain. The
>samples are all encoded to 256 kbps mp3 using Sound Forge 8.
>Recordings were made north of Kirkland, WA, USA at around 7:00 am on
>March 24, 2010.
>
>The suburban soundscape is dominated by the roar of a distant
>highway as well as planes, etc. I hope these experiments are still
>helpful in some way. I tried to get the gain structures close while
>recording but ended up adding 7.0 dB of gain (in SF) to the 722+MKH
>rig to make the background WHOOSH approximately match to my ears
>(the metering on the LS-10 is not fantastic for this but I could
>have done better with a better noise/reference source). The 722 gain
>was set to display +61.8dB of gain. This is higher than I normally
>run the gain and likely into the range where the 722 gain display
>seems less accurate. I used the 722's internal M-S decoder with M-S
>set to the mid "*" position. The LS-10 gain was set to approximately
>"1.5" on the control. The LS-10 mic sense was set to "HIGH" and low
>cut was set to "OFF."
>
>In this first test I have the Telingas clipped to my Sennheiser HD
>280 Pro headphones. Here's a pic:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4207.jpg>http://mikewallm=
usic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4207.jpg
>
>I guess Klas will need a different marketing model. The mics are
>about 10 cm from my head and in a plane about 5 cm below the top of
>my head. The elements are pointing away from my head. There was very
>little thought regarding this choice of mic location! The clips just
>happen to hold very securely to my headphones in this position.
>Audio:
>Telingas:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100059_edit.mp3>http://mike=
wallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100059_edit.mp3
>MKH:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T158_edit+7dB.mp3>http://mike=
wallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T158_edit+7dB.mp3
>
>In this test I strapped the Telingas to a tree. Here are some pics:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4189.jpg>http://mikewallm=
usic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4189.jpg
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4191.jpg>http://mikewallm=
usic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4191.jpg
>From the rear, for perspective. Yes, I am aimed at the house in this
>test:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4194.jpg>http://mikewallm=
usic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4194.jpg
>
>For your amusement I intentionally walk around, plug in a fountain,
>unplug the fountain, and walk a bit more. Audio:
>Telingas:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100060_edit_tree.mp3>http:/=
/mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100060_edit_tree.mp3
>MKH:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T159_edit+7dB.mp3>http://mike=
wallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T159_edit+7dB.mp3
>
>For this clip I unplugged the Teingas and strapped the LS-10 to the
>tree. I left the gain unchanged so it is very quiet (I did not
>correct the gain in SF).
>Here's a pic:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4195.jpg>http://mikewallm=
usic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/IMG_4195.jpg
>LS-10 built-in mics audio:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100062_edit_built-in_mics.m=
p3>http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100062_edit_built-in_mics.=
mp3
>
>For this final test I brought both rigs into my music room which is
>fairly quiet. I pointed them the same direction at a stack of foam
>bass traps. The gain was left unchanged:
>Telingas:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100063_edit_quiet.mp3>http:=
//mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/LS100063_edit_quiet.mp3
>MKH:
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T160_edit_quiet.mp3>http://mi=
kewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T160_edit_quiet.mp3
>
>I was surprised by the very high level of "rumble" from the MKH rig
>so I made sure the heater was off and recorded a bit more "quiet:"
><http://mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T161_edit_quiet2+7.mp3>http:/=
/mikewallmusic.com/MKHandTelingaOmnis/T161_edit_quiet2+7.mp3
>
>The RMS is ~3.5 dB lower this time, but still lots of rumble
>compared to the Telingas+LS-10. I recall a discussion about
>intrinsic high-pass in the LS-10 and that may be a big part of the
>difference. I have done no analysis beyond running SF's "statistics"
>tool.
>
>I hope this was of some interest.
>Best Regards,
>Mike
>
>
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