Hi Denise,
I think the worry is less about birding-aus people and more about the general
public. The video has gone viral so will be seen by millions of people, many of
whom will probably not learn it is a hoax.
When working with farmers in the southern Flinders Ranges a few years back I
had people telling me that Wedge-tailed Eagles would take babies and the lot of
them should be shot. Some were quite proud of how many they had killed. It
would be sad if the outcome of such a well-constructed student project was
eagles around the world getting persecuted, but lets just say I won't be very
surprised if that is what happens.
Cheers,
Chris
Sent from my iPhone
On 20/12/2012, at 9:53 AM, Denise Goodfellow <> wrote:
> Hi Nikolas
>
> I'm always hopeful that Birding Aussers, unlike many of those I encountered
> when I was involved with the Lindy Chamberlain affair, can weigh up both
> sides of the story.
>
> Denise
>
>
> On 20/12/12 9:13 AM, "Nikolas Haass" <> wrote:
>
>> Hi Denise & John,
>
> John, I agree with your point. However, I would not have
>> expected an Australopithecus africanus child in a treetop. O.K. I need to
>> have
>> a closer look at the publications.
>
> Denise, of course it should be open for
>> discussion. The problem is that the more sensational story is always the one
>> the stays in peoples' minds... E.g. it is well known that domestic dogs are
>> much more dangerous than any wild canid (or introduced such as the Dingo).
>> However, a story of a dingo/eagle stealing a baby is much more 'interesting'
>> than the gazillionst story of the German Shepherd killing
>> 'its' family's baby/a Rainbow Lorikeet shredding someone's fingers
>> ;-)
>
> Cheers,
>
> Nikolas
>
> ----------------
> Nikolas
>> Haass
>
> Sydney, NSW
>
>
> ________________________________
> From:
>> Denise Goodfellow <>
> To: Nikolas Haass
>> <>; Eve Belisle <>; Carl Clifford
>> <>
> Cc: Birding Aus <>
> Sent:
>> Thursday, December 20, 2012 9:35 AM
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Golden Eagle
>> attempts to take child
>
>
> Re: [Birding-Aus] Golden Eagle attempts to take
>> child
> Hi Nicholas
> I’m happy to accept that it might be a hoax, but my point
>> is that such birds may well be capable of taking a small child as they could
>> a
>> lamb. In that case it’s a moot point whether the Taung child was actually
>> killed by a raptor or scavenged.
>
> Yes, some people may over-react as they
>> did when it was finally accepted that dingoes (like other dogs) could and
>> would kill a human being, and as some still do with venomous snakes or
>> spiders
>> or sharks. Does that mean the issue shouldn’t be open for
>> discussion?
>
> Regards
> Denise
>
>
> On 20/12/12 7:33 AM, "Nikolas Haass"
>> <> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Denise,
>>
>> It is pretty clear that it is a hoax
>> - see previous mails. Further to the already mentioned points (including that
>> the originators of the clip already explained how they faked it) has anyone
>> had a look at the jizz of the bird? It is supposed to be a Golden Eagle, but
>> the jizz doesn't look like that of an aquiline eagle at all. Almost looks
>> like
>> that the students 'borrowed' features from different genera to create their
>> movie!
>>
>> Thanks for sending through the interesting Berger & McGraw paper on
>> Stephanoaetus-type eagles and an Australopithecus africanus child.
>> Admittedly,
>> I didn't have the chance to read the paper in detail but it is clear that
>> they
>> compared skull damage marks to those caused by Stephanoaetus-type eagles (see
>> also Gilbert et al. 2009 American Journal of Physical Anthropology). Maybe
>> due
>> to my superficial reading I missed an important point: Can they really rule
>> out that the eagle KILLED the Australopithecus or did it just SCAVENGE on a
>> dead one?
>> We have to be very careful with overinterpreting these kinds of
>> data. Similar stories already brought Lammergeier (Bearded Vulture) to the
>> brink of extinction. And there are certainly many other
>> examples...
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Nikolas
>>
>> ----------------
>> Nikolas
>> Haass
>>
>> Sydney,
>> NSW
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> ________________________________
>> From: Denise
>> Goodfellow <>
>> To: Eve Belisle
>> <>; Carl Clifford <>
>> Cc: Birding
>> Aus <>
>> Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2012 7:07
>> AM
>> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Golden Eagle attempts to take child
>>
>>
>> It
>> is possible that this isn't a hoax.
>>
>> There is evidence from the 2 million
>> year old fossil of a small South
>> African child (Australopithecus africanus)
>> that it was killed by a large
>> bird of prey about the same size as our
>> Wedge-tailed eagle (Berger, L.R.
>> and Mcgraw, W.S.{2007}. Further evidence
>> for eagle predation of, and
>> feeding damage on, the Taung child. South African
>> Journal of Science,
>> vol.103, n.11-12:496-498).
>>
>> I wouldn't at all be
>> surprised at an eagle having a go at a child. After all
>> what's the difference
>> between a toddler and a well-grown lamb? Being human
>> doesn't preclude one
>> being prey.
>>
>> Too well do I remember that baby Azaria Chamberlain being
>> snatched by a
>> dingo was considered a hoax as well. All the time my
>> semi-traditional
>> Aboriginal relatives were telling me that they knew that
>> dingoes would take
>> infants, evidence that I handed on to then criminologist,
>> Dr. Paul Wilson,
>> who was researching the issue.
>>
>>
>> Denise Lawungkurr
>> Goodfellow
>> 1/7 Songlark Street,
>> Bakewell, NT 0832
>> 043 8650 835
>>
>> PhD
>> candidate, SCU
>> Vice-chair, Wildlife Tourism Australia
>> Nominated for the
>> Condé Nast international ecotourism award, 2004 by the
>> renowned American
>> website, Earthfoot.
>> Wildlife Adviser, BBC¹s ŒDeadly 60¹
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 19/12/12
>> 11:04 PM, "Eve Belisle" <> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>> Several
>> aspects are wrong with this video, the first one being that the
>>> ground has
>> been covered in snow for at least a week here in Montreal. The
>>> second thing
>> is that this eagle is not a golden, the white patches on the
>>> wings does not
>> correspond to any stage of a young golden eagle plumage. It has
>>> been
>> suggested that it could be a Steppe Eagle or an hybrid, common in
>>> falconry.
>> The child is probably a doll, I think it's a well staged hoax!
>>
>> Eve
>> Bélisle
>> Montréal, Canada
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 2012-12-19, at 06:48,
>> Carl
>>> Clifford <> wrote:
>>
>>> It is certainly a bit
>> of a
>>> curates egg as far as videos go, which is why I qualified with
>> "seems
>>> genuine". There are parts which look kosher and parts with an aura
>> of shonk. I
>>> guess the only way to know is for someone to do a proper
>> forensic rip down on
>>> the original of the clip. It is the sort of clip which
>> brings many "experts"
>>> out of the woodwork.
>>>
>>> Carl Clifford
>>>
>>> On
>> 19/12/2012, at 22:00, Wendy
>>> Cayless <> wrote:
>>>
>>
>>>> Seems it is a fake
>> http://wtvr.com/2012/12/19/viral-fake-out-golden-eagle-snatches-kid-is-cgi/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Wendy
>>>> http://twitter.com/WendyJoy
>> http://wjcsydney.wordpress.com
>>> http://kiva.org/invitedby/wendy2641
>>
>>>>
>>>> From: Carl Clifford
>>> <>
>>>> To: Birding-Aus
>> Aus <>
>>>
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, 19 December 2012 6:43
>> PM
>>>> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Golden
>>> Eagle attempts to take child
>> Dear B-A,
>>>>
>>>> Interesting footage of a
>>> Golden Eagle attempting to take
>> a toddler in a park in Montreal, Quebec. It
>>> seems to be genuine.
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE0Q904gtMI
>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> Carl
>> Clifford
>>>> =
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