Hi Denise & John,
John, I agree with your point. However, I would not have expected an
Australopithecus africanus child in a treetop. O.K. I need to have a closer
look at the publications.
Denise, of course it should be open for discussion. The problem is that the
more sensational story is always the one the stays in peoples' minds... E.g. it
is well known that domestic dogs are much more dangerous than any wild canid
(or introduced such as the Dingo). However, a story of a dingo/eagle stealing a
baby is much more 'interesting' than the gazillionst story of the German
Shepherd killing 'its' family's baby/a Rainbow Lorikeet shredding someone's
fingers ;-)
Cheers,
Nikolas
----------------
Nikolas Haass
Sydney, NSW
________________________________
From: Denise Goodfellow <>
To: Nikolas Haass <>; Eve Belisle <>; Carl
Clifford <>
Cc: Birding Aus <>
Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2012 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Golden Eagle attempts to take child
Re: [Birding-Aus] Golden Eagle attempts to take child
Hi Nicholas
I’m happy to accept that it might be a hoax, but my point is that such birds
may well be capable of taking a small child as they could a lamb. In that case
it’s a moot point whether the Taung child was actually killed by a raptor or
scavenged.
Yes, some people may over-react as they did when it was finally accepted that
dingoes (like other dogs) could and would kill a human being, and as some still
do with venomous snakes or spiders or sharks. Does that mean the issue
shouldn’t be open for discussion?
Regards
Denise
On 20/12/12 7:33 AM, "Nikolas Haass" <> wrote:
Hi Denise,
>
>It is pretty clear that it is a hoax - see previous mails. Further to the
>already mentioned points (including that the originators of the clip already
>explained how they faked it) has anyone had a look at the jizz of the bird? It
>is supposed to be a Golden Eagle, but the jizz doesn't look like that of an
>aquiline eagle at all. Almost looks like that the students 'borrowed' features
>from different genera to create their movie!
>
>Thanks for sending through the interesting Berger & McGraw paper on
>Stephanoaetus-type eagles and an Australopithecus africanus child. Admittedly,
>I didn't have the chance to read the paper in detail but it is clear that they
>compared skull damage marks to those caused by Stephanoaetus-type eagles (see
>also Gilbert et al. 2009 American Journal of Physical Anthropology). Maybe due
>to my superficial reading I missed an important point: Can they really rule
>out that the eagle KILLED the Australopithecus or did it just SCAVENGE on a
>dead one?
>We have to be very careful with overinterpreting these kinds of data. Similar
>stories already brought Lammergeier (Bearded Vulture) to the brink of
>extinction. And there are certainly many other examples...
>
>Cheers,
>
>Nikolas
>
>----------------
>Nikolas Haass
>
>Sydney, NSW
>
>
>
>
>>________________________________
> From: Denise Goodfellow <>
> To: Eve Belisle <>; Carl Clifford
><>
>Cc: Birding Aus <>
> Sent: Thursday, December 20, 2012 7:07 AM
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Golden Eagle attempts to take child
>
>
>It is possible that this isn't a hoax.
>
>There is evidence from the 2 million year old fossil of a small South
>African child (Australopithecus africanus) that it was killed by a large
>bird of prey about the same size as our Wedge-tailed eagle (Berger, L.R.
>and Mcgraw, W.S.{2007}. Further evidence for eagle predation of, and
>feeding damage on, the Taung child. South African Journal of Science,
>vol.103, n.11-12:496-498).
>
>I wouldn't at all be surprised at an eagle having a go at a child. After all
>what's the difference between a toddler and a well-grown lamb? Being human
>doesn't preclude one being prey.
>
>Too well do I remember that baby Azaria Chamberlain being snatched by a
>dingo was considered a hoax as well. All the time my semi-traditional
>Aboriginal relatives were telling me that they knew that dingoes would take
>infants, evidence that I handed on to then criminologist, Dr. Paul Wilson,
>who was researching the issue.
>
>
>Denise Lawungkurr Goodfellow
>1/7 Songlark Street,
>Bakewell, NT 0832
>043 8650 835
>
>PhD candidate, SCU
>Vice-chair, Wildlife Tourism Australia
>Nominated for the Condé Nast international ecotourism award, 2004 by the
>renowned American website, Earthfoot.
>Wildlife Adviser, BBC¹s ŒDeadly 60¹
>
>
>
>
>On 19/12/12 11:04 PM, "Eve Belisle" <> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>Several aspects are wrong with this video, the first one being that the
>> ground has been covered in snow for at least a week here in Montreal. The
>> second thing is that this eagle is not a golden, the white patches on the
>> wings does not correspond to any stage of a young golden eagle plumage. It
>> has
>> been suggested that it could be a Steppe Eagle or an hybrid, common in
>> falconry. The child is probably a doll, I think it's a well staged hoax!
>
>Eve
>> Bélisle
>Montréal, Canada
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>On 2012-12-19, at 06:48, Carl
>> Clifford <> wrote:
>
>> It is certainly a bit of a
>> curates egg as far as videos go, which is why I qualified with "seems
>> genuine". There are parts which look kosher and parts with an aura of shonk.
>> I
>> guess the only way to know is for someone to do a proper forensic rip down on
>> the original of the clip. It is the sort of clip which brings many "experts"
>> out of the woodwork.
>>
>> Carl Clifford
>>
>> On 19/12/2012, at 22:00, Wendy
>> Cayless <> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Seems it is a fake
>>>
>> http://wtvr.com/2012/12/19/viral-fake-out-golden-eagle-snatches-kid-is-cgi/
>>>
>>
>>> Wendy
>>> http://twitter.com/WendyJoy
>>> http://wjcsydney.wordpress.com
>>>
>> http://kiva.org/invitedby/wendy2641
>>>
>>>
>>> From: Carl Clifford
>> <>
>>> To: Birding-Aus Aus <>
>>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, 19 December 2012 6:43 PM
>>> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Golden
>> Eagle attempts to take child
>>>
>>> Dear B-A,
>>>
>>> Interesting footage of a
>> Golden Eagle attempting to take a toddler in a park in Montreal, Quebec. It
>> seems to be genuine.
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE0Q904gtMI
>>>
>>>
>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Carl Clifford
>>> =
>> ===============================
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