Collecting birds

[Michael Todd <>]

Hello Peter and others,

I'm probably going to regret getting involved in this discussion, but I'm
fairly sure that you have misconstrued what was being said in your quote
below. 

"As Pandiburra Bore is
the only South Australian location from which specimens have been taken
it
was considered sound ornithology for present and future workers to be
given
the opportunity to assess the identity and sub-specific status
of a bird
found at such a distance from there."

I read that paragraph as stating that they wanted future workers to have
the opportunity to decide for themselves the identity of that particular
individual (ie. which subspecies) which was so far out of range. Fifty
years from now the taxonomy of Yellow Chats might be very different to
what it is now thus it could be of interest to future workers to see this
particular individual. They can't go to other museums as they obviously
have different specimens. 

I've met the J. Eckert who wrote this article and can honestly that I was
very impressed with the man.  I personally am uncomfortable with
collecting specimens but I don't cast aspersions on those that do. Its
probably in part a generational thing, it may be a dying tradition.

I know that many will say good riddance to the collecting of specimens.
However they should remember that a large part of what we now know about
birds (and animals in general) was discovered by the old-time collectors
some of whom must have been brilliant observers without the technological
aids that we take for granted today. Todays birdos should probably give a
bit of recognition/ respect for those that came before them as each new
generation tends to have it a little bit easier with a greater body of
knowledge about our birds having been already documented. I'm in awe of
birdos like John Gilbert who didn't have field guides, waterproof roof
prisms and telescopes. If it wasn't for his gun he would have a great
deal of difficulty identifying anything that he saw!

Works like Schodde and Mason's Directory of Australian Birds would not be
possible without specimen collections. These collections also provide
genetic material which will be of increasing importance in the future.

What I find more disturbing than the collecting of specimens is that
people are so quick to demonise those who use different methods to their
own. A little bit of tolerance goes a long way.

Cheers (I think)

Mick Todd
Griffith, NSW

At 07:35 PM 30/07/2003 +0930, Peter Waanders wrote:
> Thanks Tony, the SA Ornithologist
> was still on my pile of things to read. I
> have now read the article concerned and am thoroughly appalled by
> this
> incident and the attitudes it reflects.
>
> Eckert, J & Ludewigs, M: Yellow Chat Epthianura crocea at Tolderol
> Game
> Reserve. South Australian Ornithologist 34, pp83-84, May 2003.
>
> A few quotes:
> "On 22 April 2002, a chat was flushed from an area of sedge and salt
> water
> couch .... west of the bird hide of Tolderol Game Reserve..."
> (SA).
> "The bird was not seen until 26 April 2002 when it was found on a
> property
> adjoining Tolderol to the west some 2 km from the original
> sighting."
> "The bird allowed vehicular approach to within 15 m. It was
> collected and is
> now in the South Australian Museum, Reg. No. B 49,500. As Pandiburra Bore
> is
> the only South Australian location from which specimens have been taken
> it
> was considered sound ornithology for present and future workers to be
> given
> the opportunity to assess the identity and sub-specific status of a
> bird
> found at such a distance from there."
>
> Obviously the observers must have been driving around with some means
> of
> "collecting" the bird ( presumably some weapon). This is
> questionably in
> itself - who goes birdwatching with a gun? Did they go out to
> deliberately
> "collect" the bird?
>
> Apart from that, the last quote is a blatant reflection of the
> narrow-minded, parochial, old-fashioned attitude present here in SA.
> There
> is no justification for shooting a bird in particular not boundaries on
> a
> map. Presumably there are specimens in museums elsewhere in Australia.
> If
> "workers" want to research Yellow Chat they can go and access
> them there.
> Just because this bird happened to overshoot the State boundaries by a
> long
> way is no justification for collecting it - certainly not in this day
> and
> age. Instead, the observers should have made it more widely known that
> this
> bird was present at Tolderol, so that people with the appropriate
> equipement - telescopes, digital cameras, video cameras, whatever -
> could
> have shared in the enjoyment of watching it and providing useful
> pictorial
> evidence of this rare occurrence. Instead, they not only chose to keep
> this
> sighting to themselves (and their little clique, one assumes), they went
> one
> step further and shot it - thereby eliminating all chances for 
> other
> birdwatchers to see it.
>
> It just shows how far behind we are here in Oz but particularly in
> SA.
> Having come from the well-developed twitching scene in Western
> Europe
> (imagine shooting a rarity in the UK and then publishing it!!!), I
> am
> continuously frustrated by the secretive, old-fashioned attitudes of some
> of
> these old socks who haven't moved into the 20th century yet - let alone
> the
> 21st. I am embarrased to be a birdwatcher in SA.
>
> Being a member of the SAOA I might just look into this further. As far
> as
> I'm concerned, the person who "collected" this
> "specimen" should be stripped
> of their membership and any scientific standing they may still have,
> and
> they should be publicly reprimanded.
>
> Cheers
>
> Peter Waanders
> Waikerie, South Australia
>
> Birding SA:
> http://www.riverland.net.au
> E-mail: 
>
> Birding-Aus is on the Web at
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