I agree, with Simon. Scott mentioned confronting photographers who climbed
the fence to reach the goshawks' nesting tree. I'd like to hear more such
stories.
Denise
On 19/8/12 1:10 PM, "Simon Mustoe" <> wrote:
>
> Here here Richard.
>
> Each time birders pass the buck to twitchers, it allows the wider birding
> community to avoid having to take responsibility. There are too many armchair
> critics (especially on this forum) .. my question is, why doesn't someone do
> something at the time? Why aren't birders standing up to the problem when they
> see it - take a photo, shout at the person, shame them into appropriate
> behaviour. If there are 30 birders standing watching, then they are all
> complicit if they let it happen.
>
> We're very swift to attack and defame people on the forum for innocent
> behaviour - African gentlemen asking for assistance, philanthropic documentary
> film-makers to name two recent examples. We vent spleen on people openly for
> minor indiscretion when we're protected by a firewall and cyberspace anonymity
> ... but these tactics when applied to something really important for
> birdwatching, like the Red Goshawk disturbance issue, reveal these armchair
> debates to be as fruitless as they really are.
>
> If we have a problem with the behaviour of birders, then what are we going to
> do about it? Let's not sit and snipe at sector of the birding community that
> aren't to blame, let's identify the perpetrators of the problem and cajole
> these individuals into behaving themselves. Let's set a standard - I'm not
> talking about a 'code of ethics' ... it's obvious what ethics are and their
> existence doesn't alter the behaviour of people. How birders behave is
> determined by social norms and no-one wants to be subject to negative peer
> pressure from their chosen social group.
>
> This is a problem that needs to be solved by birders not by BirdLife
> Australia, governments or the police - it's good that it's been raised here as
> a problem but unless people act when they see misdemeanours occur, no
> difference will ever be made. I would start by speaking out in the field ...
> there's enough birders in this country to start making the message stick.
>
> Regards,
>
> Simon.
>
> PS - we have to be careful not to make mountains out of molehills too. As
> important as this nest is, the misbehaviour of a few is no reason to create a
> stigma around birders or twitching in general. I'm fed up of recent national
> press criticism of birders by spokespeople for the birding community. It
> doesn't solve the problem ... it just creates more division.
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
> Simon Mustoe
> Tel: +61 (0) 405220830 | Skype simonmustoe | Email
>
>
> Visit BIRD-O at http://www.bird-o.com
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>
>
>
>
>> From:
>> Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2012 13:06:47 +1000
>> To:
>> CC: ;
>> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Red Goshawk harrassment
>>
>> Steve, Shirley, Denise and others,
>>
>> I'm struggling to make the connection with a group of 30-40 birders camped
>> near a Red Gos nest in NT, obviously on some kind of birding tour through the
>> NT, with twitching. It appears that every time someone disturbs a bird,
>> they're labelled a inconsiderate twitcher. I wonder if asked, how many
>> people in that group would call themselves twitchers or actually ARE
>> twitchers?
>>
>> Our scientific community traps, mist nets, tags, bands, handles, takes blood
>> samples, cannon nets, radio tags, egg collects, shoots and generally disturbs
>> more birds in any week of the year than all Australia's twitchers combined
>> over the last 100years!
>>
>> Mmmmmm!
>>
>> Cheers
>> Richard
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On 17/08/2012, at 10:37 AM, Peter Shute <> wrote:
>>
>>> Maybe, but when people want close photos of raptors, they seem to build a
>>> tower with a hide on top, and wait for the birds to get used to it. Surely
>>> climbing the tree would just result in the birds flying away and not coming
>>> back till you're gone, if ever.
>>>
>>> Peter Shute
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: John Tongue
>>>> Sent: Friday, 17 August 2012 9:52 AM
>>>> To: Peter Shute
>>>> Cc: 'Denise Goodfellow'; Birding Aus
>>>> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Red Goshawk harrassment
>>>>
>>>> Or over-zealous photographer??
>>>>
>>>> John Tongue
>>>> Ulverstone, Tas.
>>>>
>>>> On 17/08/2012, at 9:24 AM, Peter Shute wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Climbing the tree doesn't sound like normal birder bad behaviour. That
>>>> sounds more like an egg collector.
>>>>>
>>>>> Peter Shute
>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: [birding-aus-
>>>>>> On Behalf Of Denise Goodfellow
>>>>>> Sent: Friday, 17 August 2012 7:43 AM
>>>>>> To: Birding Aus
>>>>>> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Red Goshawk harrassment
>>>>>>
>>>>>> While in Mataranka recently I heard about the behaviour of some
>>>> birders
>>>>>> towards the Red Goshawk near Bitter Springs. Some had climbed the
>>>> fence
>>>>>> into private property and one, according to the proprietor of the
>>>> nearby
>>>>>> caravan park , had even climbed the tree in which the bird nested.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Several other birders (thirty or forty according to the proprietor)
>>>> had
>>>>>> camped outside their property opposite the nesting tree.
>>>>>> That year, according to the proprietor, the birds didn't raise any
>>>>>> young.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Some years ago I warned birders of the ramifications of bad behaviour
>>>> re
>>>>>> entry to the Leanyer Sewage Ponds. The result was that access to the
>>>>>> ponds
>>>>>> was tightened considerably.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The goshawks have now shifted their nest well away from the road. If
>>>>>> they
>>>>>> shift it again then the bird may well be out of sight of visiting
>>>>>> birders,
>>>>>> and they'll be dependent on the goodwill of the owner of that
>>>> property
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> let them in. I think that reserve of goodwill may be wearing thin.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Denise Lawungkurr Goodfellow
>>>>>> 1/7 Songlark Street,
>>>>>> Bakewell, NT 0832
>>>>>> 043 8650 835
>>>>>>
>>>>>> PhD candidate, SCU
>>>>>> Vice-chair, Wildlife Tourism Australia
>>>>>> Nominated for the Condé Nast international ecotourism award, 2004 by
>>>> the
>>>>>> renowned American website, Earthfoot.
>>>>>> Wildlife Adviser, BBC¹s ŒDeadly 60¹
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Birds of Australia's Top End and Quiet Snake Dreaming available on
>>>>>> amazon.com
>>>>>> A second edition of Fauna of Australia¹s Top End used by the
>>>> University
>>>>>> of
>>>>>> NSW as a text for 12 years is now under preparation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 'It gave me huge insight into the lives' of Aboriginal Australians¹,
>>>>>> Jonathon Franzen, American author, birder, conservationist (August,
>>>>>> 2011)
>>>>>> on Quiet Snake Dreaming.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> www.denisegoodfellow.com ( to be launched again soon).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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