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Re: Green Frog Chorus

Subject: Re: Green Frog Chorus
From: "Danny" dannymeltzer
Date: Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:48 pm ((PDT))
Not entirely sure I'd agree with 'don't worry about the levels'.

While I agree nature tracks should generally be given more dynamic range th=
an most other types of material, if you put a track on a CD peaking at -50d=
b and someone tries to play it they will find that it is excessively quiet =
[compared to every other CD they own].  Part of mastering is getting tracks=
 to play well together and in a way that you want in relation to other mate=
rial that people listen to.  I try not to let [even quiet] tracks ride belo=
w -40db.  And there is a certain amount of dynamic range [ratio between lou=
dest and quietest levels] that would be too dynamic for most listeners.  No=
 one wants to raise the level on a quiet track only to have something much =
much louder come in and blast them out of their seats.
There is definitely a use for compression and limiting in certain instances=
.  In the real world our brains do it for us automatically.

--- In  Mark Brennan <=
..> wrote:
>
> Usually John I dont touch the gain in post, especially if the levels were=
 good
> at the time of the recording. Sometimes I=C2=A0might push certain frequen=
cies to=C2=A0give
> the soundscape a better 'composition" in post.=C2=A0For me nature recordi=
ng
> is=C2=A0different than music production. Sometimes a quiet environment de=
serves a
> quiet approach where as recording something like surf (its power and deep=
 bass
> sound) deserves an approach that will bring out those characteristics. Th=
e only
> thing I would say is pay attention to everything you hear in the field an=
d see
> if you can bring it all out by getting the mics in the right place. As fo=
r CD
> production, I dont=C2=A0worry too much about the levels.. the tracks spea=
k for
> themselves I guess and as long as you have a consistent approach in the=
=C2=A0field
> things should be ok. I am sure there are others on the list who=C2=A0coul=
d likely
> offer more technical advice than=C2=A0I !
> tks
>
> Mark
>
> =C2=A0
> Mark A. Brennan
> Canadian Landscape Painter - web
> Nature Recordist - web
> Follow me on:
> twitter=C2=A0 facebook=C2=A0 soundcloud=C2=A0 bandcamp
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: John Carroll <>
> To: 
> Sent: Tue, June 21, 2011 6:51:24 PM
> Subject: [Nature Recordists] Re: Green Frog Chorus
>
> =C2=A0
>
>
> Thanks Mark for the detailed info on your approach to field recording. Ve=
ry
> helpful. As a relative beginner here, its great to hear details about how=
 others
> do it.
>
>
> I wasn't thinking so much about recorder gain as getting the output volum=
e right
> in post-processing, for posting on Soundcloud or similar sites on the web=
. Final
> volume of a track would seem to be especially relevant to putting multipl=
e
> tracks on a CD. Anyway, thanks again for the info.
>
>
> John
>
> --- In  Mark Brennan <markbrennanfineart=
@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi John, thanks
> >
> > I dont use any cut off filters, either on mics or the Fostex Fr2le, I u=
sed to
> > though, but no longer.
> >
> >
> > As for the gain. I usually sit for a few minutes and watch the levels b=
efore I
>
> > start recording but also listen too, I am looking to make the recording=
 as
> > natural as possible. I suppose it comes down to=C3=82=C2=A0what we hear=
 ourselves and
> >what
> >
> > we like. I=C3=82=C2=A0dont like the gain way up,=C3=82=C2=A0for me when=
 the gain is pushed it
> >reduces
> >
> > the tranquillity of the=C3=82=C2=A0recording and it becomes much less w=
hat i am feeling
> >and
> >
> > hearing. When i first started I=C3=82=C2=A0used to push the gain in the=
 false hope that
> >it
> >
> > would be a better=C3=82=C2=A0recording (perhaps it is to some ears, but=
 not to mine!). I
> >am
> >
> > getting better=C3=82=C2=A0at judging what I am looking for.
> >
> > So I do use the levels but also my ears, I keep the=C3=82=C2=A0headphon=
es volume at half
>
> > and then adjust the overall gain knob on the fostex, first turning it u=
p and
> > then bringing down to the point where I feel it=C3=82=C2=A0reflects the=
 'soundscape' when
> >i
> >
> > listen without headphones. I only push the gain slightly above what I a=
m
> > hearing. I know there are technical ways to do this, I have spoken to M=
artyn
> > Stewart and I hope to read some of Bernies stuff on how to accurately a=
nd
> > consistently record soundscapes - =C3=82=C2=A0but the=C3=82=C2=A0equipm=
ent and our own senses vary
> >so
> >
> > much I=C3=82=C2=A0think we may all differ slightly in our approach. As =
Martyn says, get
> >it
> >
> > right in the field and it makes life easier in post. I am no expert tho=
ugh and
>
> > am still learning! I think it also depends what you are looking for, if=
 it's an
> >
> > actual biological record of an eco-system using=C3=82=C2=A0the soundsca=
pe then=C3=82=C2=A0there are
> >
> > parameters that must be followed, but right now my goals are more to ge=
nerate
> > interest in the general public about nature and nature awareness, so fo=
r that
> > reason, I think i look at it as a bit of an art form right now, but tha=
t may
> > change as time ticks by.
> > great question!
> >
> > I am sure others on the list would have different ways of doing this th=
at suits
> >
> > their own ideas and feelings about being in nature. I supose in a nutsh=
ell its
>
> > an expression, from where I place the mics, to where I want to go that =
morning
>
> > right=C3=82=C2=A0down to what captures my imagination. One thing though=
 that is really
> >key
> >
> > is finding the sweet spot. Its like the focal point in a painting. I ta=
ke my
> > time to do this and move the mics around with the headphones on, listen=
ing
> > intently to 'find' what I think works for me. But sometimes its just pl=
ain
> >luck!
> > Hope this helps
> >
> > cheers
> >
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >
> >
> > =C3=82=C2=A0
> > Mark A. Brennan
> > Canadian Landscape Painter - web
> > Nature Recordist - web
> > Follow me on:
> > twitter=C3=82=C2=A0 facebook=C3=82=C2=A0 soundcloud=C3=82=C2=A0 bandcam=
p
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: John Carroll <carrolljohnl@>
> > To: 
> > Sent: Mon, June 20, 2011 3:06:43 PM
> > Subject: [Nature Recordists] Re: Green Frog Chorus
> >
> > =C3=82=C2=A0
> >
> >
> > A beautiful recording! You are fortunate to have such tranquil places f=
or
> > recording, free of constant human-generated noise intrusions.
> >
> > Would you mind saying more about the array used for the AT4022s? Also, =
do you
> > use the low-cut filter on the 4022 mics?
> >
> > Finally, how do you adjust the final volume level of recordings posted =
on
> > Soundcloud? I'm asking because there is a lot of variability (in genera=
l) in
> >the
> >
> > volume level of nature recordings on Soundcloud. Some people boost the =
volume
> > quite a bit while others are very quiet and require the speaker volume =
to be
> > cranked way up while playing back. Is there a standard approach to adju=
sting
> > final volume of nature tracks?
> >
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> > John
> >
> > --- In  Mark Brennan <markbrennanfinea=
rt@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > A Green Frog Chorus from last night just as the last night approached=
.
> > >
> > > http://soundcloud.com/wildearthvoices/wetland-dusk
> > >
> > > 2X AT4022 (array)=C3=82=C2=A0into Fostex FR2LE
> > >
> > > mark
> > > =C3=82=C2=A0
> > > Mark A. Brennan
> > > Canadian Landscape Painter - web
> > > Nature Recordist - web
> > > Follow me on:
> > > twitter=C3=82=C2=A0 facebook=C3=82=C2=A0 soundcloud=C3=82=C2=A0 bandc=
amp
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>








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