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Re: ATRAC don't get no respect

Subject: Re: ATRAC don't get no respect
From: Walter Knapp <>
Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2003 23:19:55 -0400
oryoki2000 wrote:
> ATRAC technology was developed
> to save disc storage and reduce 
> bandwidth during data transmission,
> while maintaining a high degree of
> fidelity to the original source.  
> ATRAC does a fine job meeting 
> these criteria.

Actually, ATRAC was just for the disk storage. mp3 is the one developed 
for data transmission. And for those keeping up, there is a replacement 
for mp3 in the new mpeg standards. Which is called AAC. We can start 
haggling over that now and avoid the rush.

> In some quarters, however, ATRAC will 
> always be the Rodney Dangerfield of 
> recording technologies:
> "I tell ya, I don't get no respect."

Sounds about right.

> This is because ATRAC will always be
> criticized for creating, by design,
> an approximation of the original source.
> Saying the result is "indistinguishable
> from the original" doesn't change the
> fact that 80% of the original digital
> material is discarded, and other data
> added, when creating the ATRAC version. 

As I've noted it's a error to think ATRAC even keeps 20% of the original 
data. The more I dug into it, the more it became clear that it should 
rather be thought of as synthesizing a whole new set of data, and 
storing instruction on how to do this. Yes, a approximation, but so is 
anything that comes out of a A/D - D/A cycle.

> Some recordists will always prefer to 
> work from the original digital material, 
> rather than an approximation.  When disc
> space is at a premium, these recordists
> choose to use "lossless" compression.
> The new DEVA recorders employ this approach,
> for example.

My own experience with lossless compression has been that it is often 
easy to hear the changes it makes. Though I can hardly claim to have 
tried all forms. And even at best these compression methods don't gain 
much. I was unimpressed with those I tried. That was some time ago. 
Maybe they have gotten it right this time. I've heard good things about 
some of the newer versions.

It's actually worse as far as originals. There are still some who think 
the original original is the only one to work with. Even for digital 
recording.

I recently had to explain to one of the folks who's really behind that 
my tape does not run at the "wrong speed", and is not even tape. He'd 
decided that something was wrong with one of the recordings because the 
calls were occurring a little slower interval than his mental image. 
Several of us explained to him that one of the things about digital is 
that's not really a issue. Or if it is your recorder is very, very sick. 
The frogs just felt like calling a little slower that night. Not at all 
unusual.

> ATRAC has proven to be an excellent and 
> widely respected tool for recording.  
> But it will always be criticized. Whether 
> this matters or not is really the choice 
> of the recordist.  

What bothers me more is the attitude that somehow a recordist cares 
less, or knows less because they use it. That they are less 
"scientific", educated, or whatever. That their recordings are less 
important or listened to less critically. That's hardly the case. If 
anything those who use ATRAC probably know a lot more about it than 
those who criticize. Having been bombarded with criticizm they have 
taken the time to learn a little. And they certainly are the ones with 
more experience with it.

Luckily, I don't depend on approval from the anti ATRAC crowd, the 
people who receive my scientific recordings provide me and my recordings 
with plenty of respect. And they know exactly what I record with. All 
they ask for is more. If they worry it's that I might stop. These are 
biologists who are extremely familiar with every nuance of frogcalls, 
and they do listen to what I record very carefully.

Walt




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