A well thought out and measured comment Peter.
David Richardson
On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 11:15 AM, Peter Shute <> wrote:
> I agree it's interesting, but not that it's useful. I can't see much in the
> article that isn't at least insensitive, although I can see that it reflects
> the views many people hold (I hope no one takes that as an insult).
>
> "ABORIGINAL traditional owners recently banned about 50 birdwatchers from
> entering their land to see a rare parrot. The decision came across as
> petty."
>
> It might have come across as petty to some, but I doubt the matter was
> treated that way by the people that made it. If only one or two groups of
> birders had made permit applications then I assume it's quite possible that
> they would have got a permit. There's no way they were ever going to issue
> permits for the number that did apply.
>
> I don't think the article is useful in any other way than that it proves
> that there are some people who think the decision was wrong. We already knew
> that. Perhaps the situation did present an opportunity for the locals to get
> involved as paid guides, but that's not something that was going to be set
> up at the drop of a hat for 80 birders who suddenly wanted to go there, so
> that suggestion isn't relevant to this case.
>
> I don't really think birding-aus is the place for discussions like this, so
> I welcome any moves by the moderators to close it down, but the link was
> posted here and is birding related, so I'm responding.
>
> Peter Shute
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:
> > On Behalf Of Simon Mustoe
> > Sent: Tuesday, 5 October 2010 9:35 AM
> > To: ; ;
> >
> > Subject: RE: [Birding-Aus] Ashmore Reef information
> >
> >
> > If there are connotations of racism or 'blame' in this
> > article, I guess it's got nothing to do with birding or
> > birders. So putting those other matters aside and just
> > looking at it's mention that the indigenous community has
> > lost out - isn't this interesting to birders?
> >
> > Since the Princess Parrot debacle, this is the first time
> > that anyone in the Australian media has questioned whether
> > banning birders outright was actually the best option. That
> > would seem to me, to be a very reasonable hypothesis. So on
> > that point, I think this should be of interest to birders and
> > at least someone has had the gumption to mention it.
> >
> > Remember, this article was written by a journalist ... not by
> > Bird-O - so don't shoot the messenger ; ) ... this is me ducking!
> >
> > All the best,
> >
> > Simon.
> >
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> > Simon Mustoe
> > Tel: +61 (0) 405220830 | Skype simonmustoe | Email
> >
> >
> > Visit BIRD-O at http://www.bird-o.com
> > Follow BIRD-O on Twitter http://www.twitter.com/birdodotcom
> > Like BIRD-O on Facebook? Visit
> > http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/pages/Bird-O/117732794921095
> > Email BIRD-O at
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2010 07:31:15 +0930
> > > Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Ashmore Reef information
> > > From:
> > > To: ; ;
> > >
> > >
> > > If the NT News really wanted a more accurate target they should be
> > > looking towards the government department that helped sink my
> > > relatives' tourism project on Baby Dreaming. For example,
> > elders were
> > > told (as was I) that they needed a "Certificate 4 in
> > training" (cost -
> > > several thousand dollars for each person), to teach
> > particular skills to others.
> > >
> > > Also, a Scandinavian birding tour operator offered the community a
> > > donation of a couple of thousand dollars to train residents to show
> > > visitors sandstone birds. My relatives were very excited. But the
> > > money had to go through a birding or conservation organisation. A
> > > Birds Australia spokesman told me it was 'too little' to be worth
> > > their while. And then there's the debacle of the latest
> > effort to train Indigenous bird guides in Kakadu.
> > > There's plenty of blame to go around, but very little of it
> > should be
> > > directed at Aboriginal people.
> > > Denise
> > >
> > >
> > > on 5/10/10 7:15 AM, Bill Stent at wrote:
> > >
> > > > Simon, I'm not sure that "useful" is quite the word that
> > I'd use to
> > > > describe the NT News article.
> > > >
> > > > "Racist" might be closer. Possibly "patronising" if I
> > were feeling
> > > > more conciliatory.
> > > >
> > > > Not a good hook to get readers to Bird-o.
> > > >
> > > > Bill
> > > >
> > > > --------------------------------------------------
> > > > From: "Simon Mustoe" <>
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 8:28 AM
> > > > To: <>
> > > > Subject: [Birding-Aus] Ashmore Reef information
> > > >
> > > >>
> > > >> Hi,
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> ASHMORE REEF
> > > >>
> > > >> Ashmore reef trips are nearly upon us so we've put together
> > > >> information for you, on this remarkable place. If you
> > visit Bird-O
> > > >> and go to "Birding REGIONS" in the top menu, you'll find
> > access to
> > > >> a page about Ashmore Reef and the NW Shelf. You can see
> > images from
> > > >> past trips, read about its history and the birds that have been
> > > >> seen there. There's also new article which summarises
> > the birding
> > > >> highlights from the last 14 trips and information on how
> > you can plan your trip to Ashmore Reef next year.
> > > >>
> > > >> CENTRAL AUSTRALIA
> > > >>
> > > >> There's another regional page set up for Central Aus.
> > This is a way
> > > >> to support our growing birding tour industry so email us
> > if you're
> > > >> interested in being part.
> > > >>
> > > >> OUTBACK HAS UNSEEN BUCKS
> > > >>
> > > >> Also of interest, an article in NT News titled "Outback
> > has Unseen
> > > >> Bucks" - a useful follow-up to the recent Princess
> > Parrot debarcle.
> > > >> http://search.twitter.com/search.atom?q=%23birdonews
> > > >>
> > > >> To keep updated with this news, follow us on Twitter,
> > Facebook or
> > > >> sign up for the newsletter.
> > > >>
> > > >> Happy birding!
> > > >>
> > > >> Simon.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > >>
> > > >> Simon Mustoe
> > > >> Tel: +61 (0) 405220830 | Skype simonmustoe | Email
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Visit BIRD-O at http://www.bird-o.com Follow BIRD-O on Twitter
> > > >> http://www.twitter.com/birdodotcom
> > > >> Like BIRD-O on Facebook? Visit
> > > >> http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/pages/Bird-O/117732794921095
> > > >> Email BIRD-O at
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> ==========
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> > > >>
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