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Re: A quick and dirty comparison of some handheld recorders

Subject: Re: A quick and dirty comparison of some handheld recorders
From: "Rob Danielson" danielson_audio
Date: Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:09 pm ((PDT))
At 3:25 PM -0400 7/18/09, Matt Blaze wrote:
>
>Thanks. all, for the kind words.
>
>I'll try to do more of these comparisons under different conditions,
>but it depends on my ability to wrangle both the recorders and the
>time to use them simultaneously (my students are using some of them in
>my day job, too).
>
>Thanks Rob for your analysis -- very helpful. I find the performance
>of all these devices to be remarkable Although the self-noise is
>audible in the worst of the recordings, it's still not *bad*. And
>although the Sonys are the (clear) winners in terms of noise
>performance, they are also the largest and heaviest of their class,
>just a bit too big to live unobtrusively in a jacket pocket or
>backpack. Essentially, these tests convince me that that my practice
>of always carrying around the LS-10 or the ARES (the two smallest and
>lightest of the bunch) -- just in case an interesting sound comes up
>-- is likely not to make me regret my failure to have with me
>something bigger and better.

Hi Matt--
I took a Zoom H2 out with me to 4th of July weekend happenings to 
test the built-in mics on robust sound sources-- a parade, street and 
bandstand musicians, a baseball game crowd and a dunk tank and 
fireworks. All of the subjects came out better than I thought they 
would considering how easy it was to use the H2.

 From my perspective, the drawback with simple, "pocket recording" is 
I can't stop to make a good stereo recording if I want to. The stereo 
imaging of the built-in mics is quite flat and unexciting.  I tried a 
bunch of micing positions with subjects that had potential.  When the 
subject to micing distance got under 3 feet, the image started to 
come alive.

I'm not suggesting that one needs to carry heavy, ultra low-noise mic 
rigs around, there are plenty of ways to generate exciting stereo 
imagery using small, easy to mount and DIY stereo mic arrays. 
"Stereo" done well seems to be a fairly important quality factor when 
I'm enjoying field recordings. DIY stereo arrays based on space omnis 
are a very economical way to improve the results of these "pocket 
recorders" and many recordists and students also enjoy increasing 
their participation in the recording process.

>The best recorder, like the best camera,
>is the one you have with you, after all.
>
>The dog bark is definitely revealing, and a very different image from
>the rest the recordings. When I started setting up, the dog in the
>yard two houses to the right was having a heated exchange with the dog
>in the yard of the house to the left, but by the time I was rolling it
>was just ending, apparently with the left dog getting the last word in
>and then shutting up. Oh well.

The dog is portrayed on the left with the M-S  array and slightly to 
the left with the H4n's and your mystery rig. He's in the center on 
the others. Rob D.

>
>Best
>
>-matt
>
>On Jul 18, 2009, at 12:35, Rob Danielson wrote:
>
>>  At 7:28 AM -0700 7/18/09, Dan Dugan wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>  I finally got around to making simultaneous recordings (of a very
>>>>  boring suburban soundscape) with a sampling of current generation
>>>>  handheld recorders:
>>>>
>>>>  * Nagra ARES-MII
>>>>  * Sony PCM-D1
>>>>  * Sony PCM-D50
>>>>  * Olympus LS-10
>>>>  * Zoom H4n
>>>>  * Sennheiser MKH-800 Mid-Side pair on a Nagra VI (OK, not exactly
>>>>  pocket size, but a useful baseline)
>>>>  * A mystery mic that I'll describe later
>>>
>>>>  For whatever it's worth, the audio can be found at:
>>>> 
>>>><<http://www.crypto.com/audio/shootout/>http://www.crypto.com/audio/shootout/><http://www.crypto.com/audio/shootout/>http://www.crypto.com/audio/shootout/
>>>
>>>  That's worth a lot, thank you very much, Matt.
>>>
>>>  -Dan Dugan
>>
>>  Hi Matt-
>>  Same here!
>>
>>  Matching background presence between the files (there were very small
>>  differences in levels from your peak matches), I found HF noise
>>  performance using the built-in mics performance decreased in this
>>  order:
>>
>>  Sennheiser MKH-800 (reference)
>  > Sony PCM-D1 (tie with) Sony PCM-D50
>>  Zoom H4n
>>  Olympus LS-10
>>  Nagra ARES-MII
>>  Mystery mic (The HF response of this mic seems considerably
>>  compromised)
>>
>>  The dog bark provided me the most useful medium range stereo imaging
>>  and overall tonal comparisons. The background ambience was most
>>  useful for detecting the self-noise of the mics and wide stereo
>>  imaging.
>>
>>  <http://tinyurl.com/m6vvcj>http://tinyurl.com/m6vvcj (9mb QT movie)
>>
>>  <http://tinyurl.com/m7m6ma>http://tinyurl.com/m7m6ma (mp3 with 
>>bark and pres samples in this
>>  order
>>  Sennheiser MKH-800 (reference)
>>  Sony PCM-D1
>>  Sony PCM-D50
>>  Zoom H4n
>>  Olympus LS-10
>>  Nagra ARES-MII
>>  Mystery mic
>>
>>
>>  A few things I noticed:
>>
>>  (1) The LS-10's and ARES-MII's built-in mics are significantly
>>  brighter.
>>  (2) The built in mics have much less lateral stereo imaging than the
>>  M-S reference but among these, the Zoom H4n and the Mystery X-Y mic
>>  seem to be slightly wider.
>>  (3) The built-in mics on the H4n seem to be a little quieter than
>>  those in the LS-10. The LS-10's built-in mics are noisy enough to
>>  lose the advantage this recorder should have over the H4n based on
>>  input noise measurements of the mic preamps of these two recorders.
>>  (4) The D50 has better frequency response under 130Hz than the D1.
>>  The H4n also has pretty good response in the lowest frequencies
>>
>>
>>  I guess its predictable (though unfortunate) that one would be able
>>  to hear the self-noise of the built-in mics in surburban environment,
>>  but it is interesting to hear how much less audible HF self-noise
>>  there is in the built-in mics of the Sony units-- consistent with
>>  Raimund's comment of a few days ago.
>>
>>  The stereo imaging of all of the built-in mics does seem to be
>>  minimal for distant subjects.
>>
>>  I'm guessing the "mystery" mics are off the shelf DIY electrets
>>  perhaps from radio shack plugged into a H2.
>>
>>  Thanks again,
>  > Rob D.
>>


-- 









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