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Re: mp3 in natural sound recording

Subject: Re: mp3 in natural sound recording
From: "1GDW" <>
Date: Mon, 01 Aug 2005 21:08:51 -0000
--- In  "Rich Peet" <> 
wrote:
> In my comparing of various .mp3 settings I have not found a hiss
> generated by the mp3 encoding.  I do find in some compressions hiss
> that is more objectionable because there have been more "holes" 
blown
> into existing hiss during the encode. For example, linked is a less
> than 10% saturation mono file with the first half being the 
original
> wave after being converted to 16bit, and the second half being the
> same sound compressed into a mp3. Compression was 12.6 to 1 or 
56kbps
> at a 44.1 khz sample rate with a maximum bandpass of 12,002 cycles.
> Encode by Fraunhofer IIS done within Adobe Audition. I leave it to
> your ears if you find the high pitched hiss worse on the 2nd half 
of
> this recording.
> 
> In mp3 compression of files I am not a fan of "variable bit rates" 
for
> natural sound. All of these vbr methods, I conclude, make artifacts
> worse in quiet recordings.
> 
> I would like a new "nature quiet" encode for .mp3. In this I would
> like to see a complete 12,000 cutoff for highs, and 70 cycle for 
lows.
> With various choices all in constant bit rate. Then I would also
> prefer that the codex rather than have a pitch eliminated more 
pitches
> are effected but at a 6 db level rather than an infinite cut 
level. 
> 
> 2.5 meg download example at:
> http://home.comcast.net/~richpeet/mp3.wav
> 
> Rich Peet
> 
> 
> --- In  Klas Strandberg
> <> wrote:
> > Rob, can you make a "hiss" demo with different MP3 settings?? I 
am 
> > unfamiliar with that sort of hiss. The noise I hear on John's
> recordings 
> > sounds like "typical transistor noise".
> > 
> > John - can we have a few seconds of the Robin or Coyote 
as .wav?? I
> really 
> > need to sort this out.
> > 
> > Klas.
> > 
> > At 03:24 2005-08-01, you wrote:
> > >Thanks John! Love the yotes. Is the first single perhaps 
calling for
> > >a  \partner thats out of range?  She/he is turning and calling 
in
> > >different directions right?  The sources of three slap back 
echos
> > >towards the end are interesting to think about too.
> > >
> > >I believe the widely distributed hiss, waivering and artifacts 
are
> > >largely the result of the the mp3 encoding. Its 1:45 long  and
> > >requires 1.6mb, so a data rate of 15.6K bytes/sec. Low even for 
mp3
> > >standards. An uncompressed file would give us a better sense of
> > >noise, if any, introduced byt the pre. Rob D.
> > >
> > >   = = =
> > >
> > >
> > >At 2:55 AM +0200 8/1/05, Klas Strandberg wrote:
> > > >Hi John!
> > > >
> > > >In his "self-noise" debate: Now when I hear your recordings 
again
> - after
> > > >getting acquainted with the NT1A, - I think I hear a hiss 
which
> does not
> > > >come from the mic.
> > > >
> > > >It could be atmospheric noise (leaves, grass in very minor 
wind)
> but it
> > > >sounds electronic. Is it the PMD670 or something else?
> > > >
> > > >Or is this what the NT1A sounds like when it is cold?
> > > >Which temperature did you have?
> > > >I hear it also on the Robin recording. Same "hiss".
> > > >
> > > >Klas.
> > > >
> > > >   when I listen to your recordings.At 01:08 2005-08-01, you 
wrote:
> > > >>Last weekend I returned to the Aldrich Mountains: this time 
we
> stayed
> > > >>at Deer Creek Guard Station.  One nice thing about this 
forest
> service
> > > >>cabin (and also the one at Murderers Creek) is no 
electricity. The
> > > >>lights, refrigerator, and stove run on propane, which does 
make some
> > > >>noise but nothing like the annoying hums and buzzes that 
come from
> > > >>electrical devices.
> > > >>
> > > >>Just after dark I went out on a walk listening for owl 
sounds, but I
> > > >>didn't hear any.  A little later as the nearly full moon rose
> from the
> > > >>trees and illumined the meadow, a coyote began beckoning 
others to
> > > >>join in chorus.  In this recording there are two coyotes, 
some
> > > >>crickets, and a mystery bird - any takers? (1.6MB) (PMD670 
full
> gain,
> > > >>NT1-As at 60deg and with barrier):
> > > >>
> > > >>http://www.rockscallop.org/ear/jh-050722-nightcoyote.mp3
> > > >>
> > > >>For Rob Danielson's comparisons of recorders and 
microphones, he
> > > >>requested examples recorded at full gain. For the PMD-670, 
the
> maximum
> > > >>gain is an unimpressive 45dB.  Here's a 30 sec example at 
dawn
> at full
> > > >>gain.
> > > >>
> > > >>http://www.rockscallop.org/ear/jh-050723-0424_rl10-60dg-
b1.mp3
> > > >>
> > > >>Here's another short example with the levels set at 7 out of 
10.
> > > >>
> > > >>http://www.rockscallop.org/ear/jh-050723-0521_rl07-60dg-
b1.mp3
> > > >>
> > > >>Here's another example (PMD670 set at 7) of coyotes joining 
in
> chorus
> > > >>around 5:30 am.
> > > >>
> > > >>http://www.rockscallop.org/ear/jh-050723-
0526_coyotechorus.mp3
> > > >>
> > > >>Any comments, questions, or suggestions are welcomed.
> > > >>-John Hartog
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>"Microphones are not ears,
> > > >>Loudspeakers are not birds,
> > > >>A listening room is not nature."
> > > >>Klas Strandberg
> > > >>Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >Telinga Microphones, Botarbo,
> > > >S-748 96 Tobo, Sweden.
> > > >Phone & fax int + 295 310 01
> > > >email: 
> > > >         
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >"Microphones are not ears,
> > > >Loudspeakers are not birds,
> > > >A listening room is not nature."
> > > >Klas Strandberg
> > > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >--
> > >Rob Danielson
> > >Film Department
> > >University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee
> > >
> > >
> > >"Microphones are not ears,
> > >Loudspeakers are not birds,
> > >A listening room is not nature."
> > >Klas Strandberg
> > >Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > 
> > Telinga Microphones, Botarbo,
> > S-748 96 Tobo, Sweden.
> > Phone & fax int + 295 310 01
> > email: 
> >         





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