5. Re: Greenfinch in Brisbane (Elliot Leach)
Weekend of 9-10th May 8 were sighted on Lord Howe Island, along with 3
Goldfinch. Goldfinches still about.
Most likely blow ins from NZ
So it's possible they could have blown in
Hank Bower
Manager Environment/World Heritage
Lord Howe Island Board
PO Box 5
Lord Howe Island
NSW 2898
Ph: 02) 6563 2066 (ext 23)
Fax: 02) 6563 2127
email:
-----Original Message-----
From: Birding-Aus On Behalf Of
Sent: Monday, 18 May 2015 2:30 AM
To:
Subject: Birding-Aus Digest, Vol 19, Issue 16
Send Birding-Aus mailing list submissions to
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than "Re: Contents of Birding-Aus digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria (Kev Lobotomi)
2. Re: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria (Carl Clifford)
3. how about promoting petitions here (berenice pearcy)
4. Re: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria (Bill Stent)
5. Re: Greenfinch in Brisbane (Elliot Leach)
6. Raven calls (Graeme Chapman)
7. Re: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria (Kev Lobotomi)
8. Re: Raven calls (Kev Lobotomi)
9. Re: Raven calls (Kev Lobotomi)
10. Re: Raven calls (Bill Stent)
11. Re: Raven calls (Kev Lobotomi)
12. Re: Greenfinch in Brisbane (Mike Owen)
13. Re: Raven calls (Kev Lobotomi)
14. Re: how about promoting petitions here (Shirley Cook)
15. Advertising / Petitions (Russell Woodford)
16. RFI Brisbane owls (Ian Reid)
17. Birdpedia - Australia - Weekly Digest (Birdpedia - Australia Info)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 16 May 2015 22:22:17 +1000
From: Kev Lobotomi <>
To: Bill Stent <>, <>
Subject: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Could be either little or Australian in that area. What did they call like
like.-Kevin Bartram
--- Original Message ---
From: "Bill Stent" <>
Sent: 16 May 2015 10:11 PM
To:
Subject: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
A couple of weeks ago I was at Chum Creek near Healesville in Victoria. I had
to pick my daughter up from a scout camp. While I was there, a couple of ravens
flew over, calling as they did. My immediate thought was that they were Aussie
ravens, and was surprised that they were there, but then I wasn't sure. The
calls weren't quite right for Aussie or Little.
Could I have been hearing Aussies after all - the calls were much closer to
that than Littles (and no, they definitely weren't Forests). Or could I have
heard some odd local dialect of Littles?
Any thoughts?
<HR>
<BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
<BR>
<BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
<BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
</HR>
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sat, 16 May 2015 22:29:44 +1000
From: Carl Clifford <>
To: Bill Stent <>
Cc: "" <>
Subject: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Could certainly be a regional dialects. Ravens and other corvids are known to
have them. I have been caught out the same way in the past.
Carl Clifford
> On 16 May 2015, at 10:10 pm, Bill Stent <> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> A couple of weeks ago I was at Chum Creek near Healesville in Victoria. I had
> to pick my daughter up from a scout camp. While I was there, a couple of
> ravens flew over, calling as they did. My immediate thought was that they
> were Aussie ravens, and was surprised that they were there, but then I wasn't
> sure. The calls weren't quite right for Aussie or Little.
>
> Could I have been hearing Aussies after all - the calls were much closer to
> that than Littles (and no, they definitely weren't Forests). Or could I have
> heard some odd local dialect of Littles?
>
> Any thoughts?
> <HR>
> <BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
> <BR>
> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
> </HR>
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 09:41:39 +1000
From: berenice pearcy <>
To:
Subject: how about promoting petitions here
Message-ID:
<>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Hi guys
I am very new birder and I am interested in all activities of bird watching
(except pelagic-i get sea-sick). Just wondering if I can promote relevant
petitions/crowdfunding on this site eg Birdlife Aus crowdfunding to track
the grey plover or the a petition to Tassie Government to protect the swift
parrot etc
kindly Berenice
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 08:24:04 +1000
From: Bill Stent <>
To: Kev Lobotomi <>
Cc: "<>" <>
Subject: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
They had the Aussie wail, but it was just not like the ones you hear north of
Bendigo. If I had have been up there when I heard them I would have said it's a
couple of Aussies with a sore throat.
On 16/05/2015, at 10:22 PM, Kev Lobotomi <> wrote:
> Could be either little or Australian in that area. What did they call like
> like.-Kevin Bartram
>
> --- Original Message ---
>
> From: "Bill Stent" <>
> Sent: 16 May 2015 10:11 PM
> To:
> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
>
>
>
>
> A couple of weeks ago I was at Chum Creek near Healesville in Victoria. I had
> to pick my daughter up from a scout camp. While I was there, a couple of
> ravens flew over, calling as they did. My immediate thought was that they
> were Aussie ravens, and was surprised that they were there, but then I wasn't
> sure. The calls weren't quite right for Aussie or Little.
>
> Could I have been hearing Aussies after all - the calls were much closer to
> that than Littles (and no, they definitely weren't Forests). Or could I have
> heard some odd local dialect of Littles?
>
> Any thoughts?
> <HR>
> <BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
> <BR>
> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
> </HR>
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 12:37:06 +1000
From: Elliot Leach <>
To: Andrew Thelander <>
Cc: birding-aus <>
Subject: Greenfinch in Brisbane
Message-ID:
<>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
The bird was still there this morning - does anyone have any idea where it
could have come from?
It wasn't banded (as far as I could see), but I'm assuming that it's an
escapee... it's a long, long way out of range if not.
elliot
On 16 May 2015 at 20:25, Andrew Thelander <> wrote:
> Hi folks
>
> A single European Greenfinch was seen and photographed by myself and
> others today at the Sandy Camp Road Wetlands in Wynnum North, Brisbane. I
> have posted some pics on the birding-aus Facebook page.
>
> A rare sighting for Brisbane.
>
> cheers
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <HR>
> <BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
> <BR>
> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
> </HR>
>
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 11:50:51 +1000
From: Graeme Chapman <>
To:
Cc:
Subject: Raven calls
Message-ID:
<>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Hello Bill,
In my experience there is little variation in Australian Raven calls from place
to place all over Australia, except for the SW of W.A. where they all sound
distinctly different in pitch (Listen on my website under Western Raven.)
However if you are talking repertoire, Australian Ravens have a call for almost
every occasion. When they are chasing a raptor (such as on call LS100104 on my
website) they sound almost hysterical whereas at rest (mild advertisement, at
rest call) the calls almost suggest the mood. When I hear that hysterical call,
I always look at the sky because I know there'll usually be a Wedgie or a
Little Eagle up there or sometimes a smaller raptor. The raven-like calls you
heard may have just been one you are not familiar with - for instance they have
a quite distinctive travelling call when flying high overhead which may be a
signal to the resident birds below that they are doing just that, travelling,
and have no territorial intents.
Little Ravens are a different story. Like Australian Ravens they do have a
repertoire, perhaps less distinctive to our ears, but there are other
variables. Birds from the interior are on average smaller than those from
alpine areas and to my ear, the bigger alpine birds have deeper sounding calls
. Little Ravens and Forest Ravens form a superspecies (that is they are very
closely related) and Forest Ravens, which are even bigger again have even
deeper calls. I like to think I've had more experience with our crows and
ravens than most people these days (I studied them with CSIRO and Ian Rowley
for nearly ten years) but I do admit that occasionally I hear a corvid call
that makes me think, as you did at Chum Creek. The ones I have found most
difficult were either from the Coorong/SE South Australia or from south
Gippsland, where both Little and Forest Ravens occur together. Corvids vary a
lot in size. Males are mostly bigger than females by about 10% but the birds we
used to call runts (the youngest of a clutch of five that only survive in good
seasons - normally they starve and fail to fledge) go through life as much
smaller birds and probably sound like wimps as well!! I did handle a bird once
which, on measurement was midway between Little Raven and Forest Raven and I
wouldn't be surprised if one day somebody finds these two species as a mixed
pair.
As somebody has pointed out certainly both Australian and Little Ravens can
occur at Chum Creek, and even Forest Raven would be a possibility - the Prom
isn't that far away and corvids do wander.
So you can see there are lots of variables and without hearing a recording of
your birds at Chum Creek, we'll never know. One thing I do know is that
Australian Ravens from Chum Creek will sound like Australian Ravens from
anywhere else in the eastern states. I am not aware of any local dialects. That
doesn't mean there aren't any - just that they are hard to discern. As with any
other passerines, most of their repertoire is learnt and like the vowel sounds
in humans, they would vary from place to place. If you really want to hear
regional variation in an Australian bird, go listen to the Grey Butcherbirds.
Regards
Graeme Chapman
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 09:35:18 +1000
From: Kev Lobotomi <>
To: Bill Stent <>
Cc: "<>" <>
Subject: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi Bill
The calls of both ravens vary enormously. They both can wail. But with Little
it tends to be a much shorter wail. The main difference is the tone of the
call. Australians have a higher pitch, Little is quite low (Forest lower
still). Kev
--- Original Message ---
From: "Bill Stent" <>
Sent: 17 May 2015 8:24 AM
To: "Kev Lobotomi" <>
Cc: "<>" <>
Subject: Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
They had the Aussie wail, but it was just not like the ones you hear north of
Bendigo. If I had have been up there when I heard them I would have said it's a
couple of Aussies with a sore throat.
On 16/05/2015, at 10:22 PM, Kev Lobotomi <> wrote:
> Could be either little or Australian in that area. What did they call like
> like.-Kevin Bartram
>
> --- Original Message ---
>
> From: "Bill Stent" <>
> Sent: 16 May 2015 10:11 PM
> To:
> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Raven calls, Chum Creek, Victoria
>
>
>
>
> A couple of weeks ago I was at Chum Creek near Healesville in Victoria. I had
> to pick my daughter up from a scout camp. While I was there, a couple of
> ravens flew over, calling as they did. My immediate thought was that they
> were Aussie ravens, and was surprised that they were there, but then I wasn't
> sure. The calls weren't quite right for Aussie or Little.
>
> Could I have been hearing Aussies after all - the calls were much closer to
> that than Littles (and no, they definitely weren't Forests). Or could I have
> heard some odd local dialect of Littles?
>
> Any thoughts?
> <HR>
> <BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
> <BR>
> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
> </HR>
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 13:49:29 +1000
From: Kev Lobotomi <>
To: Graeme Chapman <>,
<>
Cc: <>
Subject: Raven calls
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi Graeme
I had a good listen to sw WA Aussie Ravens and they sound exactly the same as
eastern birds to me. Kev
--- Original Message ---
From: "Graeme Chapman" <>
Sent: 17 May 2015 1:26 PM
To:
Cc:
Subject: Raven calls
Hello Bill,
In my experience there is little variation in Australian Raven calls from place
to place all over Australia, except for the SW of W.A. where they all sound
distinctly different in pitch (Listen on my website under Western Raven.)
However if you are talking repertoire, Australian Ravens have a call for almost
every occasion. When they are chasing a raptor (such as on call LS100104 on my
website) they sound almost hysterical whereas at rest (mild advertisement, at
rest call) the calls almost suggest the mood. When I hear that hysterical call,
I always look at the sky because I know there'll usually be a Wedgie or a
Little Eagle up there or sometimes a smaller raptor. The raven-like calls you
heard may have just been one you are not familiar with - for instance they have
a quite distinctive travelling call when flying high overhead which may be a
signal to the resident birds below that they are doing just that, travelling,
and have no territorial intents.
Little Ravens are a different story. Like Australian Ravens they do have a
repertoire, perhaps less distinctive to our ears, but there are other
variables. Birds from the interior are on average smaller than those from
alpine areas and to my ear, the bigger alpine birds have deeper sounding calls
. Little Ravens and Forest Ravens form a superspecies (that is they are very
closely related) and Forest Ravens, which are even bigger again have even
deeper calls. I like to think I've had more experience with our crows and
ravens than most people these days (I studied them with CSIRO and Ian Rowley
for nearly ten years) but I do admit that occasionally I hear a corvid call
that makes me think, as you did at Chum Creek. The ones I have found most
difficult were either from the Coorong/SE South Australia or from south
Gippsland, where both Little and Forest Ravens occur together. Corvids vary a
lot in size. Males are mostly bigger than females by about 10% but the birds we
used to call runts (the youngest of a clutch of five that only survive in good
seasons - normally they starve and fail to fledge) go through life as much
smaller birds and probably sound like wimps as well!! I did handle a bird once
which, on measurement was midway between Little Raven and Forest Raven and I
wouldn't be surprised if one day somebody finds these two species as a mixed
pair.
As somebody has pointed out certainly both Australian and Little Ravens can
occur at Chum Creek, and even Forest Raven would be a possibility - the Prom
isn't that far away and corvids do wander.
So you can see there are lots of variables and without hearing a recording of
your birds at Chum Creek, we'll never know. One thing I do know is that
Australian Ravens from Chum Creek will sound like Australian Ravens from
anywhere else in the eastern states. I am not aware of any local dialects. That
doesn't mean there aren't any - just that they are hard to discern. As with any
other passerines, most of their repertoire is learnt and like the vowel sounds
in humans, they would vary from place to place. If you really want to hear
regional variation in an Australian bird, go listen to the Grey Butcherbirds.
Regards
Graeme Chapman
<HR>
<BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
<BR>
<BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
<BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
</HR>
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 13:51:58 +1000
From: Kev Lobotomi <>
To: Graeme Chapman <>,
<>
Cc: <>
Subject: Raven calls
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Also there is no chance the birds could be forest ravens. This is way out of
their range and the south gippsland birds do not wander that much. Kev
--- Original Message ---
From: "Graeme Chapman" <>
Sent: 17 May 2015 1:26 PM
To:
Cc:
Subject: Raven calls
Hello Bill,
In my experience there is little variation in Australian Raven calls from place
to place all over Australia, except for the SW of W.A. where they all sound
distinctly different in pitch (Listen on my website under Western Raven.)
However if you are talking repertoire, Australian Ravens have a call for almost
every occasion. When they are chasing a raptor (such as on call LS100104 on my
website) they sound almost hysterical whereas at rest (mild advertisement, at
rest call) the calls almost suggest the mood. When I hear that hysterical call,
I always look at the sky because I know there'll usually be a Wedgie or a
Little Eagle up there or sometimes a smaller raptor. The raven-like calls you
heard may have just been one you are not familiar with - for instance they have
a quite distinctive travelling call when flying high overhead which may be a
signal to the resident birds below that they are doing just that, travelling,
and have no territorial intents.
Little Ravens are a different story. Like Australian Ravens they do have a
repertoire, perhaps less distinctive to our ears, but there are other
variables. Birds from the interior are on average smaller than those from
alpine areas and to my ear, the bigger alpine birds have deeper sounding calls
. Little Ravens and Forest Ravens form a superspecies (that is they are very
closely related) and Forest Ravens, which are even bigger again have even
deeper calls. I like to think I've had more experience with our crows and
ravens than most people these days (I studied them with CSIRO and Ian Rowley
for nearly ten years) but I do admit that occasionally I hear a corvid call
that makes me think, as you did at Chum Creek. The ones I have found most
difficult were either from the Coorong/SE South Australia or from south
Gippsland, where both Little and Forest Ravens occur together. Corvids vary a
lot in size. Males are mostly bigger than females by about 10% but the birds we
used to call runts (the youngest of a clutch of five that only survive in good
seasons - normally they starve and fail to fledge) go through life as much
smaller birds and probably sound like wimps as well!! I did handle a bird once
which, on measurement was midway between Little Raven and Forest Raven and I
wouldn't be surprised if one day somebody finds these two species as a mixed
pair.
As somebody has pointed out certainly both Australian and Little Ravens can
occur at Chum Creek, and even Forest Raven would be a possibility - the Prom
isn't that far away and corvids do wander.
So you can see there are lots of variables and without hearing a recording of
your birds at Chum Creek, we'll never know. One thing I do know is that
Australian Ravens from Chum Creek will sound like Australian Ravens from
anywhere else in the eastern states. I am not aware of any local dialects. That
doesn't mean there aren't any - just that they are hard to discern. As with any
other passerines, most of their repertoire is learnt and like the vowel sounds
in humans, they would vary from place to place. If you really want to hear
regional variation in an Australian bird, go listen to the Grey Butcherbirds.
Regards
Graeme Chapman
<HR>
<BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
<BR>
<BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
<BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
</HR>
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 13:57:54 +1000
From: Bill Stent <>
To: "Kev Lobotomi" <>, "Graeme Chapman"
<>
Cc: <>
Subject: Raven calls
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8";
reply-type=original
Yes, I agree that they couldn't have been Forest Ravens.
I'm thinking they were in fact Aussies. It's just that I'm a little
surprised they occur there.
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Kev Lobotomi" <>
Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 1:51 PM
To: "Graeme Chapman" <>;
<>
Cc: <>
Subject: Raven calls
> Also there is no chance the birds could be forest ravens. This is way out
> of their range and the south gippsland birds do not wander that much. Kev
>
> --- Original Message ---
>
> From: "Graeme Chapman" <>
> Sent: 17 May 2015 1:26 PM
> To:
> Cc:
> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Raven calls
>
> Hello Bill,
>
> In my experience there is little variation in Australian Raven calls from
> place to place all over Australia, except for the SW of W.A. where they
> all sound distinctly different in pitch (Listen on my website under
> Western Raven.) However if you are talking repertoire, Australian Ravens
> have a call for almost every occasion. When they are chasing a raptor
> (such as on call LS100104 on my website) they sound almost hysterical
> whereas at rest (mild advertisement, at rest call) the calls almost
> suggest the mood. When I hear that hysterical call, I always look at the
> sky because I know there'll usually be a Wedgie or a Little Eagle up there
> or sometimes a smaller raptor. The raven-like calls you heard may have
> just been one you are not familiar with - for instance they have a quite
> distinctive travelling call when flying high overhead which may be a
> signal to the resident birds below that they are doing just that,
> travelling, and have no territorial intents.
>
> Little Ravens are a different story. Like Australian Ravens they do have a
> repertoire, perhaps less distinctive to our ears, but there are other
> variables. Birds from the interior are on average smaller than those from
> alpine areas and to my ear, the bigger alpine birds have deeper sounding
> calls . Little Ravens and Forest Ravens form a superspecies (that is they
> are very closely related) and Forest Ravens, which are even bigger again
> have even deeper calls. I like to think I've had more experience with our
> crows and ravens than most people these days (I studied them with CSIRO
> and Ian Rowley for nearly ten years) but I do admit that occasionally I
> hear a corvid call that makes me think, as you did at Chum Creek. The ones
> I have found most difficult were either from the Coorong/SE South
> Australia or from south Gippsland, where both Little and Forest Ravens
> occur together. Corvids vary a lot in size. Males are mostly bigger than
> females by about 10% but the birds we used to call runts (the youngest of
> a clutch of five that only survive in good seasons - normally they starve
> and fail to fledge) go through life as much smaller birds and probably
> sound like wimps as well!! I did handle a bird once which, on measurement
> was midway between Little Raven and Forest Raven and I wouldn't be
> surprised if one day somebody finds these two species as a mixed pair.
>
> As somebody has pointed out certainly both Australian and Little Ravens
> can occur at Chum Creek, and even Forest Raven would be a possibility -
> the Prom isn't that far away and corvids do wander.
>
> So you can see there are lots of variables and without hearing a recording
> of your birds at Chum Creek, we'll never know. One thing I do know is that
> Australian Ravens from Chum Creek will sound like Australian Ravens from
> anywhere else in the eastern states. I am not aware of any local dialects.
> That doesn't mean there aren't any - just that they are hard to discern.
> As with any other passerines, most of their repertoire is learnt and like
> the vowel sounds in humans, they would vary from place to place. If you
> really want to hear regional variation in an Australian bird, go listen to
> the Grey Butcherbirds.
>
> Regards
>
> Graeme Chapman
> <HR>
> <BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
> <BR>
> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
> </HR>
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 14:07:07 +1000
From: Kev Lobotomi <>
To: Bill Stent <>, Graeme Chapman
<>
Cc: <>
Subject: Raven calls
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
They are definitely in that area. Aussies prefer wooded areas, Little prefer
open areas like farmland. Once you get up the hills east of Melbourne you get
Aussies. Kev
--- Original Message ---
From: "Bill Stent" <>
Sent: 17 May 2015 1:57 PM
To: "Kev Lobotomi" <>, "Graeme Chapman"
<>
Cc:
Subject: Raven calls
Yes, I agree that they couldn't have been Forest Ravens.
I'm thinking they were in fact Aussies. It's just that I'm a little
surprised they occur there.
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Kev Lobotomi" <>
Sent: Sunday, May 17, 2015 1:51 PM
To: "Graeme Chapman" <>;
<>
Cc: <>
Subject: Raven calls
> Also there is no chance the birds could be forest ravens. This is way out
> of their range and the south gippsland birds do not wander that much. Kev
>
> --- Original Message ---
>
> From: "Graeme Chapman" <>
> Sent: 17 May 2015 1:26 PM
> To:
> Cc:
> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Raven calls
>
> Hello Bill,
>
> In my experience there is little variation in Australian Raven calls from
> place to place all over Australia, except for the SW of W.A. where they
> all sound distinctly different in pitch (Listen on my website under
> Western Raven.) However if you are talking repertoire, Australian Ravens
> have a call for almost every occasion. When they are chasing a raptor
> (such as on call LS100104 on my website) they sound almost hysterical
> whereas at rest (mild advertisement, at rest call) the calls almost
> suggest the mood. When I hear that hysterical call, I always look at the
> sky because I know there'll usually be a Wedgie or a Little Eagle up there
> or sometimes a smaller raptor. The raven-like calls you heard may have
> just been one you are not familiar with - for instance they have a quite
> distinctive travelling call when flying high overhead which may be a
> signal to the resident birds below that they are doing just that,
> travelling, and have no territorial intents.
>
> Little Ravens are a different story. Like Australian Ravens they do have a
> repertoire, perhaps less distinctive to our ears, but there are other
> variables. Birds from the interior are on average smaller than those from
> alpine areas and to my ear, the bigger alpine birds have deeper sounding
> calls . Little Ravens and Forest Ravens form a superspecies (that is they
> are very closely related) and Forest Ravens, which are even bigger again
> have even deeper calls. I like to think I've had more experience with our
> crows and ravens than most people these days (I studied them with CSIRO
> and Ian Rowley for nearly ten years) but I do admit that occasionally I
> hear a corvid call that makes me think, as you did at Chum Creek. The ones
> I have found most difficult were either from the Coorong/SE South
> Australia or from south Gippsland, where both Little and Forest Ravens
> occur together. Corvids vary a lot in size. Males are mostly bigger than
> females by about 10% but the birds we used to call runts (the youngest of
> a clutch of five that only survive in good seasons - normally they starve
> and fail to fledge) go through life as much smaller birds and probably
> sound like wimps as well!! I did handle a bird once which, on measurement
> was midway between Little Raven and Forest Raven and I wouldn't be
> surprised if one day somebody finds these two species as a mixed pair.
>
> As somebody has pointed out certainly both Australian and Little Ravens
> can occur at Chum Creek, and even Forest Raven would be a possibility -
> the Prom isn't that far away and corvids do wander.
>
> So you can see there are lots of variables and without hearing a recording
> of your birds at Chum Creek, we'll never know. One thing I do know is that
> Australian Ravens from Chum Creek will sound like Australian Ravens from
> anywhere else in the eastern states. I am not aware of any local dialects.
> That doesn't mean there aren't any - just that they are hard to discern.
> As with any other passerines, most of their repertoire is learnt and like
> the vowel sounds in humans, they would vary from place to place. If you
> really want to hear regional variation in an Australian bird, go listen to
> the Grey Butcherbirds.
>
> Regards
>
> Graeme Chapman
> <HR>
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> <BR>
> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
> </HR>
------------------------------
Message: 12
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 14:56:18 +1000
From: Mike Owen <>
To:
Subject: Greenfinch in Brisbane
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
It is pretty certain to have escaped. European Greenfinches are quite a
common finch in aviculture, selling for around $40 a pair - very much at
the bottom end of the price scale for aviary finches.
cheers,
Mike
Sunshine Coast
On 17-May-15 12:37 PM, Elliot Leach wrote:
> The bird was still there this morning - does anyone have any idea where it
> could have come from?
> It wasn't banded (as far as I could see), but I'm assuming that it's an
> escapee... it's a long, long way out of range if not.
>
> elliot
>
> On 16 May 2015 at 20:25, Andrew Thelander <> wrote:
>
>> Hi folks
>>
>> A single European Greenfinch was seen and photographed by myself and
>> others today at the Sandy Camp Road Wetlands in Wynnum North, Brisbane. I
>> have posted some pics on the birding-aus Facebook page.
>>
>> A rare sighting for Brisbane.
>>
>> cheers
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> <HR>
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>> <BR>
>> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
>> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
>> </HR>
>>
> <HR>
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> <BR>
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> </HR>
------------------------------
Message: 13
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 16:43:38 +1000
From: Kev Lobotomi <>
To: Graeme Chapman <>
Cc: <>
Subject: Raven calls
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi Graeme
The habitat preference statement wasn't directed at you, it was a general
statement for those following this thread. In Victoria Forest Ravens occur in
isolated populations. They are rarely seen away from those populations (except
perhaps in the west, but we're not talking about a bird from this area). It is
known that there is a population in the lakes Entrance area. They are not known
to be anywhere near Chum Creek, so any record there should be highly
scrutinised and would be a significant record, as they are not known anywhere
near Melbourne or Healesville.
--- Original Message ---
From: "Graeme Chapman" <>
Sent: 17 May 2015 2:20 PM
To: "Kev Lobotomi" <>
Cc:
Subject: Raven calls
Hello Kev,
Clearly you haven't got much of an ear for calls. It has been said that SW Aust
ravens quack like ducks by some people although I find that a bit extreme. It
is well-known fact that they sound different.
As for Forest Ravens not occurring near Chum Creek, I did say that was only a
possibility and it is. Young corvids of all descriptions wander widely. I have
just photographed one at Lakes Entrance which is further as the crow flies from
the Prom than Chum Creek.
Graeme Chapman
On 17/05/2015, at 1:49 PM, Kev Lobotomi wrote:
> Hi Graeme
> I had a good listen to sw WA Aussie Ravens and they sound exactly the same as
> eastern birds to me. Kev
>
> --- Original Message ---
>
> From: "Graeme Chapman" <>
> Sent: 17 May 2015 1:26 PM
> To:
> Cc:
> Subject: [Birding-Aus] Raven calls
>
> Hello Bill,
>
> In my experience there is little variation in Australian Raven calls from
> place to place all over Australia, except for the SW of W.A. where they all
> sound distinctly different in pitch (Listen on my website under Western
> Raven.) However if you are talking repertoire, Australian Ravens have a call
> for almost every occasion. When they are chasing a raptor (such as on call
> LS100104 on my website) they sound almost hysterical whereas at rest (mild
> advertisement, at rest call) the calls almost suggest the mood. When I hear
> that hysterical call, I always look at the sky because I know there'll
> usually be a Wedgie or a Little Eagle up there or sometimes a smaller raptor.
> The raven-like calls you heard may have just been one you are not familiar
> with - for instance they have a quite distinctive travelling call when flying
> high overhead which may be a signal to the resident birds below that they are
> doing just that, travelling, and have no territorial intents.
>
> Little Ravens are a different story. Like Australian Ravens they do have a
> repertoire, perhaps less distinctive to our ears, but there are other
> variables. Birds from the interior are on average smaller than those from
> alpine areas and to my ear, the bigger alpine birds have deeper sounding
> calls . Little Ravens and Forest Ravens form a superspecies (that is they are
> very closely related) and Forest Ravens, which are even bigger again have
> even deeper calls. I like to think I've had more experience with our crows
> and ravens than most people these days (I studied them with CSIRO and Ian
> Rowley for nearly ten years) but I do admit that occasionally I hear a corvid
> call that makes me think, as you did at Chum Creek. The ones I have found
> most difficult were either from the Coorong/SE South Australia or from south
> Gippsland, where both Little and Forest Ravens occur together. Corvids vary a
> lot in size. Males are mostly bigger than females by about 10% but the birds
> we used to call runts (the youngest of a clutch of five that only survive in
> good seasons - normally they starve and fail to fledge) go through life as
> much smaller birds and probably sound like wimps as well!! I did handle a
> bird once which, on measurement was midway between Little Raven and Forest
> Raven and I wouldn't be surprised if one day somebody finds these two species
> as a mixed pair.
>
> As somebody has pointed out certainly both Australian and Little Ravens can
> occur at Chum Creek, and even Forest Raven would be a possibility - the Prom
> isn't that far away and corvids do wander.
>
> So you can see there are lots of variables and without hearing a recording of
> your birds at Chum Creek, we'll never know. One thing I do know is that
> Australian Ravens from Chum Creek will sound like Australian Ravens from
> anywhere else in the eastern states. I am not aware of any local dialects.
> That doesn't mean there aren't any - just that they are hard to discern. As
> with any other passerines, most of their repertoire is learnt and like the
> vowel sounds in humans, they would vary from place to place. If you really
> want to hear regional variation in an Australian bird, go listen to the Grey
> Butcherbirds.
>
> Regards
>
> Graeme Chapman
> <HR>
> <BR> Birding-Aus mailing list
> <BR>
> <BR> To change settings or unsubscribe visit:
> <BR> http://birding-aus.org/mailman/listinfo/birding-aus_birding-aus.org
> </HR>
------------------------------
Message: 14
Date: Sun, 17 May 2015 17:39:47 +1000
From: "Shirley Cook" <>
To: "berenice pearcy" <>,
<>
Subject: how about promoting petitions here
Message-ID: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Many Petitions have already been promoted on this forum.
One of the problems in my experience, is that when I signed one, I received
a large number of unrelated petitions. All very worthy no doubt, but they
then "breed" petitions of their own. If there was some way to support them
without the intrusive "invasion" of other petitions it would be a good
thing.
Shirley Cook
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