Hi Tony,
Thanks for clarifying that. But I'm not quite sure from what you say what
happens if no-one makes a formal submission of, for example, the Broome
Lesser Black-backed Gull? And please be aware that I am in no way
criticising BARC. I believe that it is very important for the birding
community to have an official list of verified bird species and that the
committee does invaluable work. A quick perusal of the published rulings
indicate the care and effort required to make a decision and the long list
of under-review cases would understandably make the idea of deliberation in
the absence of a formal submission not very attractive.
But the question of "grey literature" - unverified usually internet based
publishing - will become increasingly important. The advent of high quality
digital photography makes bird identification per se significantly more
certain but it comes with I suspect a reduction in field note taking and
perhaps less formal submission of records. There may be a variety of
reasons for non-submission - observers feeling that they may not have
taken sufficiently comprehensive notes, not wanting to be embarrassed by
having a submission not accepted, afraid of stepping on the toes of the
finder or original observer, deferring to birders who may have had a better
view/photograph, being unsure of the exact taxon (there was a lot of
discussion and not a little controversy when the LBB Gull first turned up)
or simply assuming some else will. Dave Torr thinks that consideration of
birds without a submission to be a dangerous idea. I am not so sure
especially in cases of well documented new species as have occurred
recently.
Cheers
Mark
On 20 March 2013 14:55, Tony Palliser <> wrote:
> Hi Mark,
> Generally speaking BARC does take it on board to review "the Literature"
> for
> example the old Cocos (Keeling) record of Lesser Black-backed Gull is
> currently circulating. Some species are still to be submitted but I have
> no
> doubt the day will come - Slaty-backed Gull springs to mind. Additionally
> some species end up on the supplementary list for considerable periods and
> does in some part include those "awaiting a submission".
>
> Cheers,
> Tony
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> On Behalf Of Mark Stanley
> Sent: Wednesday, 20 March 2013 10:16 AM
> To: Dave Torr
> Cc:
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] IOC 894 or 896
>
> "If a tree falls in a forest and no one hears it, does it make a noise?";
> if
> a bird is seen in Australia but it is not reported to BARC is it on the
> Australia list? Both Lesser Black-backed Gull and Wigeon have been seen,
> photographed and their provenance and identification extensively discussed
> in this forum so is there any doubt that they will be on Australia list?
> The BARC "under review" list includes an old LBB claim from the Cocos
> Islands but not the recent Broome bird, nor the Wigeon.
>
> What happens if nobody submits a record? This can easily come about if the
> original observer is not that fussed/interested in going through the
> process
> of making a submission and other viewers are reluctant to put in a
> submission in case they could be viewed as "claiming" the record or do not
> want to be involved in some controversial identification.
>
> Given the fact that most significant rarities are likely to be discussed in
> forums like this, perhaps BARC should take it upon itself to review "The
> Literature" particularly on cases of species new to Australia. Some
> acknowledgement of the original finder of the bird could then be included.
> A "waiting submission" category might prompt birders to make a submission.
>
> Cheers
>
> Mark
>
> On 20 March 2013 07:01, Dave Torr <> wrote:
>
> > But are they accepted by BARC yet? It takes a while to get things
> > "officially" accepted
> >
> > On 19 March 2013 21:59, Mark Stanley <> wrote:
> >
> >> Jude & Tony,
> >>
> >> You may want to add Wigeon and Lesser Black-backed Gull to the list now.
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >>
> >> Mark
> >>
> >> Message: 3
> >> Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 20:28:45 +1100
> >> From: "Tony Palliser" <>
> >> To: "'Jude Latt'" <>, <>
> >> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] IOC 891 or 893
> >> Message-ID: <>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> >>
> >> Jude,
> >> It is a constant moving target these days - taxonomy is constantly
> >> changing and new species are still being added regularly. I make the
> >> list 891 plus 3 newly added species accepted by BARC within the last
> >> couple of months
> >> namely: Japanese Sparrowhawk, Chinese Sparrowhawk and Mugimaki
> >> Flycatcher
> >> to make the total 894. No doubt there will be more added in the not
> too
> >> distant future also.
> >>
> >> Here is a link to a list prepared by David James which was updated
> >> recently:
> >>
> >> http://www.tonypalliser.com/barc/australian_checklist.xls
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Tony
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From:
> >> On Behalf Of Jude
> >> Latt
> >> Sent: Monday, 18 March 2013 5:43 PM
> >> To:
> >> Subject: [Birding-Aus] IOC 891 or 893
> >>
> >>
> >> I am following the IOC Taxa and at this stage I have have 891 species
> >> recorded in my Birder's Diary for Australia.
> >>
> >> However, missing from my Taxa list is Eurasian Hobby or Eurasian
> >> Hoopoe which would increase my Taxa list by 2 .... 893 Australian
> species.
> >>
> >>
> >> Can someone please confirm out Aussie total now stands at 893 ?
> >> following the IOC
> >>
> >>
> >> Jude
> >> ===============================
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