I rest my case.
This has nothing to do with 'science'. This is a teenager doing what teenagers
do. How many of us got into wildlife as a teenager by doing science? I suspect
we did it out of childhood curiosity.
Why penalise children for being children?
Simon.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Simon Mustoe
Tel: +61 (0) 405220830 | Skype simonmustoe | Email
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> From:
> To: ;
> Date: Fri, 7 Dec 2012 14:15:36 +1100
> CC:
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Threatened species and the OBP
>
> The question then is whether this rule is doing a good job of protecting
> wildlife and habitats, or is doing more harm than good by making it harder
> for people to become interested in the natural world.
>
> I suspect that, given that kids seem to be able to collect shells, etc, on
> the beach unchallenged, it's not doing much harm, if any. Someone please
> correct me if they know of any cases where innocent people have been charged.
>
> Simon quoted the case of DSE chasing kids who climbed onto a dead whale. Is
> that this case:
> http://www.3aw.com.au/blogs/breaking-news-blog/outrage-over-boys-whale-stunt/20120719-22bjk.html
>
> If so, the fact that one of them is in a surfing pose on the whale makes me
> wonder how scientific his interest in it is. I also think that had they not
> photographed themselves on it, let alone posting the photos on a public
> website, nothing would have come of it, and that they could have examined the
> whale as much as they liked without problems.
>
> Peter Shute
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From:
> > On Behalf Of
> > Carl Clifford
> > Sent: Friday, 7 December 2012 12:42 PM
> > To: Stephen Ambrose
> > Cc: <>
> > Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Threatened species and the OBP
> >
> > Stephen,
> >
> > Peter is correct in surmising that the reason that one can
> > not legally pick up eggs, feathers, shell etc, is to do with
> > prosecutions. Leaving open the "I just found it on the
> > ground" loophole, would make prosecution of traffickers very
> > difficult, as the onus of proof still lies with those
> > prosecuting in this country. It is similar to reason why we
> > have the laws on "theft by finding".
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Carl Clifford
> >
> > On 07/12/2012, at 11:14, "Stephen Ambrose"
> > <> wrote:
> >
> > > I'm sure that there will be an environment bureaucrat from an
> > > Australian government department will answer Peter's question. But
> > > Denise's comments about picking up dead snakes reminds me
> > of another
> > > anecdote that I read a few weeks ago.
> > >
> > > The University of Western Australia celebrates its 100th
> > anniversary
> > > in February 2013. As part of the celebrations leading up to that
> > > event, anecdotes from past and present staff and students of the
> > > university have been published on UWA's centenary website.
> > >
> > > One anecdote, written by one of the late Professor Bert Main's Ph.D
> > > graduates from the 1950s, relates to Bert's dead snake experience.
> > > Bert Main was a Professor of Zoology at UWA and was
> > legendary for his
> > > contributions to Australian zoology and conservation,
> > particularly in the 1950s, 60s & 70s.
> > > I was fortunate to be a zoology student at UWA towards the end of
> > > Bert's career in the late 1970s to the mid 1980s. The anecdote
> > > relates to a zoology class excursion to Rottnest Island,
> > off the coast
> > > of Perth. Bert and his class of students were walking
> > along a track
> > > when they came across a dead Western Dugite (a venomous snake).
> > > Always keen to seize an opportunity, Bert picked up the
> > dead snake to
> > > show the students the locations and structure of the
> > snake's fangs.
> > > Yes, the snake was dead, but when Bert prised opened the
> > jaws of the
> > > snake with his hands, the jaws snapped shut, purely as a reflex
> > > action, the fangs sinking into one of Bert's fingers.
> > According to the anecdote, the venom made Bert seriously
> > > ill and he had to be hospitalised.
> > >
> > > So, I suspect that Peter is right about government policies that
> > > restrict the collection of dead animals and animal materials. But
> > > there are also occasions when handling dead animals might be
> > > dangerous. The dugite that Bert Main handled had probably not been
> > > dead long if the jaw muscles and ligaments were still reflexive and
> > > the venom was still potent. But a lot of road kills that members of
> > > the public might find are usually quite fresh too.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > Stephen
> > >
> > > Dr Stephen Ambrose
> > > Director
> > > Ambrose Ecological Services Pty Ltd
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From:
> > > On Behalf Of Peter
> > > Shute
> > > Sent: Thursday, 6 December 2012 1:13 PM
> > > To: 'Denise Goodfellow'; 'Simon Mustoe';
> > > ; 'Birding Aus'
> > > Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Threatened species and the OBP
> > >
> > > I assume that this policy that you can't even pick up a shell or
> > > feather is intended to simplify prosecution of those who
> > kill animals
> > > for their feathers, skins, teeth, etc. Can anyone please
> > verify that?
> > >
> > > I've often heard stories (mainly here) of people being
> > threatened like
> > > this, but are the threats ever carried out when it's
> > obvious there's
> > > not really anything untoward going on?
> > >
> > > Peter Shute
> > >
> > >> -----Original Message-----
> > >> From:
> > >> On Behalf
> > Of Denise
> > >> Goodfellow
> > >> Sent: Thursday, 6 December 2012 12:06 PM
> > >> To: Simon Mustoe; ; Birding Aus
> > >> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Threatened species and the OBP
> > >
> > >> The next day a senior ranger, whose son happened to be in Rowan's
> > >> class, rang. He had two messages for me: a) It was the
> > Conservation
> > >> Commission's job to teach kids about snakes, and b) I had
> > broken the
> > >> law in handling the dead animals, and I could be prosecuted.
> > > ===============================
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