G'day Dave,
As far as I can determine international lists are based on consultation with
resident experts from various parts of the globe as part of the list forming
process.
No list is necessarily perfect, Carl Clifford mentioned the Index of
Organism Names as his preferred source. I have just had a quick look at the
ION list and for Melithreptus species along with chloropsis, it includes
additionally, augustus, atricapillus, autralensis, calceolatus, formosanus,
fuscus, Kuwayamae, laetior, limulatus, luna tus, melanocephalus, scriptus
and suzukii. I won't be rushing to add all of these to my Australian list!.
What you should all be asking for is a re-forming of the BA taxonomic review
committee, wouldn't that be the best way to accommodate the ongoing changing
taxonomic profile.
Cheers Jeff.
-----Original Message-----
From:
On Behalf Of Dave Torr
Sent: Sunday, 31 October 2010 11:31 AM
To: jenny spry
Cc: birding-aus
Subject: White-naped Honeyeater Split
Jen
Thanks for that, but I fear that any local committee - no matter how
distinguished the membership - is inevitably going to lead to the Australian
list being different to the one used by the rest of the world (OK - there
are various world lists produced by different taxonomists and other bodies,
but we should accept one of those) and thus we will always end up with
discrepancies such as the Albatrosses.
I think there is clearly a role for Australians in trying to lobby for our
choice of names to be used, but I am less convinced that we need a different
taxonomy - for example if our local experts decided we did not accept the
split of the White-naped we could hardly lobby on what name to use for the
Western form!
Dave
On 31 October 2010 11:22, jenny spry <> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
>
>
> Following on from Dave's comments, by default, we are already starting to
> use international lists for Australian purposes.
>
>
>
> For example, BOCA and Birds Australia are currently participating in the
> Birdlife International "Important Bird Area" project (IBA). This is an
> international project where many countries around the world have declared
> certain areas "important" for the protection of "threatened species".
These
> areas are selected to protect habitat for birds listed on the IUCN Red
List
> of Endangered Species. Australia has accepted the IUCN Red list and has
> selected IBAs based on birds that are included on the IUCN Red list.
>
>
>
> In most cases this is fine, but not always. Just to illustrate the
> potential/actual conflicts, the IUCN recognizes the Indian Yellow-nosed
> Albatross (*Thalassarche carteri* ) as a threatened species, not a race.
> Races, threatened or otherwise, are not included in the IBA project, only
> species. This means that for our international participation with the IBA
> project, Birds Australia / BOCA treat *Thalassarche carteri* as a species
> but for local Australian purposes, using C & B 2008, *Thalassarche carteri
> * is classified as a race of *Thalassarche chlororhynchos*, not a full
> species.
>
>
>
> Now, I agree that the Alboatross/Mollymawk group is a very contentious
> group but this example is just one and the situation could apply to other
> Australian species both currently on, or eligible for listing with, the
IUCN
> Red list.
>
>
>
> Perhaps a solution is for BA/BOCA to constitute a group of people, along
> the lines of BARC (possibly including C & B if they are interested), to
> assess proposed changes as they arise. These changes could then be adopted
> as updates to C & B 2008, without the need to totally rewrite the one list
> every ten years or so.
>
>
>
> Also, if there is any scientific / popular wish to keep using an
Australian
> generated list, and I think there is especially in the selection of Common
> Names, then I believe our Australian generated list needs to be maintained
> before our international obligations send us to an internationally
generated
> and maintained list, by default. For an example of this problem, in
general
> communications here and elsewhere, *Melithreptus chloropsis* is already
> attracting two common names, Western White-naped Honeyeater and Swan River
> White-naped Honeyeater.
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
>
>
> Jen
>
> On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 6:48 AM, Dave Torr <> wrote:
>
>> Perhaps it is time for Australia to accept one of the International
>> taxonomies as our "official" (whatever that means) scheme. C&B will be
>> come
>> increasingly out of date as the rest of the world splits our species.
>> BARC clearly is an arbiter of "vagrants" and this is a totally separate
>> process from the taxonomy used.
>>
>> On 30 October 2010 22:49, Carl Clifford <> wrote:
>>
>> > Hi Colin
>> > Melithreptus chloropsis is listed as a full species on the ION (Index
of
>> > Organism Names) database, so it must be kosher. The ION is the
>> international
>> > arbiter of Zoological and Mycological species and it is up to them to
>> decide
>> > if a species stands or not.
>> >
>> > I don't think there will be another edition of C&B, I think 2 editions
>> was
>> > enough for them. It will probably be up to other authors to take up the
>> > challenge. Perhaps it will appear in a new edition of HANZAB, but I
>> don't
>> > think that will happen in the little tenure I have left on life.
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> >
>> > Carl Clifford
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On 30/10/2010, at 9:24 PM, Colin Scouler wrote:
>> >
>> > Hello birders.
>> >
>> > So, is the Swan River (or Western) Honeyeater now an official tick?
>> >
>> > What's the procedure in between editions of Christidis and Boles?
>> >
>> > Is this a matter for BARC to buy into?
>> >
>> > Colin Scouler.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Begin forwarded message:
>> >
>> > From: "Wedderburn Birding" <>
>> >> Date: 30 October 2010 12:44:37 PM
>> >> To: "'BIRDING-AUS'" <>, <
>>
>> >> >
>> >> Subject: [Birding-Aus] White-naped Honeyeater Split
>> >>
>> >> Following previous discussion on Birding-Aus on the possible split,
the
>> >> latest IOC list v 2.6 has split the White-naped Honeyeater
>> (Melithreptus
>> >> lunatus) into the Swan River Honeyeater (Melithreptus chloropsis),
>> which
>> >> occurs in SW Western Australia (N to Swan River Plain and Wheatbelt in
>> W).
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >>
>> >> Bruce
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
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