Amanda
Thank you for the very helpful information.
Greg Little
-----Original Message-----
From:
On Behalf Of Amanda Markham
Sent: Friday, 13 August 2010 10:29 PM
To:
Subject: Princess Parrots issue
Hi all,
I've been sitting on the side lines. I'm the manager of anthropology at an
agency which protects sacred sites across the entire NT and a dabbler in
birding. I rarely post on this forum, although I often see lots of birds in
the Centre that people want to tick off their 'life' lists.
In regards to sacred sites: there are many sacred sites in Central Australia
that you most certainly CAN stumble into and potentially damage or break
strict customs. Certain trees, particular hills, most water sources are
indeed sacred sites. There are ways of avoiding sacred sites in the NT (you
obtain a register inspection map from the Aboriginal Areas Protection
Authority - which holds a register of sacred sites for all forms of land
tenure in the NT, for purpose of site avoidance). If people are entering
sacred sites without permission, then
you can be prosecuted under the NT Sacred Sites Act in addition to the fine
for entry into Aboriginal Land.
The NT has very strict laws in regards to sacred sites - no matter
where they are.
In regard to the Aboriginal land permits issue - I can only say that the
Land Council must have been overwhelmed with 80 permit applications
-goodness only know what the Traditional Owners thought! Given that people
had already gone in there without permits... no wonder the answer was no.
Asking first and giving Traditional Owners more time to think -and Land
Council staff more time to plan these things into their workloads- may have
resulted in a better outcome.
All of us who deal with site clearances, permits etc up here are extremely
overloaded at the moment due to a number of very large projects (like the
Intervention/mining/Broadband cable). It's not fair when people from
interstate say to us 'drop everything, this is urgent' and we're expected to
order our staff to change their work programs, reallocate vehicles, cancel
fieldwork that's been planned for months. Remote area fieldwork is also
expensive - the fieldwork to clear these permits would have cost several
thousand dollars - staff wages, fuel, travel time etc. In many cases, you
can't just call Traditional Owners up on the phone. You need to drive out
several hundred km and find the people you need to talk to. Thus, the costs
for the permit would in no way cover the expenses incurred in securing it.
Yet, what I don't understand is why birders aren't turning to the Centre's
well known national parks for help?
You will probably find Princess Parrots in Watarrka National Park at the
moment. Has anyone called the rangers to ask? 08 8956 7460 . You could also
try Kings Creek Station and see if they've noticed any.
There are also Bourke Parrots on the far too infrequently visited Owen
Springs Reserve right now - just off Larapinta Drive, about 15km west of the
main Owen Springs access entrance. We've seen them.
I wouldn't be surprised if there weren't a few Princess Parrots in the far
western end of the West MacDonnell National Park and around Tnorala (Gosse)
Bluff Conservation Reserve. You could call the Ormiston Gorge Ranger
Station: 08 8956 7799 and ask.
Also, the manager at Glen Helen Resort is a keen birder. May I also suggest
calling him up to see if he's seen any Princess Parrots near Glen Helen
Gorge?
Finally, why not consider doing a 3 day trip around the Sandy Blight Track?
If you are serious and desperate to see them, then this is THE best place.
This is where I saw my first Princess Parrots in the wild three years ago -
it's absolutely brilliant country and the permits are issued within 5 days
without the need for consultation. You need to get one from CLC and from the
Ngaanyatjarra Land Council (08 8950 1711) for the WA portion. As this is a
remote area, I would recommend that you have 4WD experience, hire a sat
phone and travel in a group of cars.
I hope this is helpful and hopeful information,
Amanda
> From:
> To: ;
> Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2010 17:34:29 +1000
> Subject: RE: [Birding-Aus] Princess Parrots issue
>
> I'm no expert on this, so my answer might be naive. There is a long
history of abuse of trust by white people against aboriginal people. They
have fought long and hard to have the rights that they do have over their
traditional country. In Victoria, such rights barely exist.
>
> To allow that many people to wander around is inviting someone to stumble
on a sacred site, etc. The area is huge, but searches will most likely be
concentrated in the more hospitable areas, which I'm guessing might be where
these sites are concentrated.
>
> And don't forget that the reason given for the refusal wasn't just the
numbers, it was because people have already started to enter without
permits. If they decided to allow in 20 people at a time, how are they going
to enforce it if people are going in without permits anyway?
>
> It's really annoying that people can't get in to see these birds, but if
allowing them all in (and who knows how many would eventually come - I'm
shocked that there are already 80) might jeopardise their future ability to
excercise their rig8ht to deny entry (to miners, for example), then who
cares? The birds have been seen and documented, and while it would be good
to have the area searched more thoroughly, it's just a twitch now. It's a
very good thing that everyone has been warned well in advance they won't
have access.
>
> That's just my opinion. I'd appreciate if anyone more knowledgable about
these things could comment further.
>
> Peter Shute
>
> wrote on Friday, 13 August 2010 4:29 PM:
>
> > Hi All
> > I have been reading this thread with interest. Being
> > originally from Ireland I have no experience in access
> > permits required for what appears to me to be a public access
> > area. I know the land is 'granted' to the local inhabitants
> > and if it was the size of a suburban block I would completely
> > understand - I don't want strangers wandering around in my back yard
> > either. But we're not talking about a quarter acre or even a 10acre
> > block here are we? with cattle? or crops? We're talking about
> > a hunting ground of vast proportions with no facilities -
> > it's not even a reasonable comparison. It seems to me to be a
> > ridiculous situation. Is this not a land for all Australians?
> > I can appreciate that the locals don't want people wandering
> > anywhere all over the place possibly disturbing the game or
> > interfering with their sacred sites, but visitors would stick
> > to the few established tracks across what seems to be a
> > wilderness, wouldn't they? The amount of time anyone from
> > 'outside' would spend there would be severly limited anyway
> > and, with agreement, visiting vehicles could avoid
> > settlements to reduce any impact on the inhabitants.
> > Personally I see this as an outrageous outcome - that 80 or
> > so birders can be denied access to a huge area of virtually
> > uninhabitated countryside when a once in a lifetime
> > opportunity is presented. There is no intention to damage the
> > environment - far from it, injure, capture or destroy
> > wildlife - the very opposite, or inhabit, stay or live in the
> > area for more than a couple of days.
> > The only outcome from my perspective, I'm afraid, is a
> > further loss of respect or interest in understanding the
> > aboriginal beliefs and claims.
> > I'm sure there are those of you who will claim to understand
> > their fears, appreciate their needs and recognise their
> > beliefs. Sorry - this is an all Australian land (incidentally
> > I am an Australian citizen too) and my hard earned taxes go
> > towards supporting communities like this.
> > While I do recognise their need for isolation and the
> > opportunity to lead a way of life they feel they are entitled
> > to, barring access to other travellers under the conditions
> > decribed is just plain wrong. In fact being able to deny
> > access to anyone to what should be at least a public thoroughfare is
> > wrong. Incidentally what if you were 'lucky' enough to score the
> > first type of permit - the drive-only-don't-stop permit - and
> > you needed to go to the toilet? I'm not being funny, in
> > reality its a stupid proposition - just think about it for a
> > minute....
> >
> > By the way I had no plans to go, being unable to afford it
> > because my taxes are so high.....
> >
> > Colin
> > Brisbane
> > --
> > Colin Reid
> >
> > So many birds, so little time......==========
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