birding-aus

Re: FW: [Birding-Aus] John Young and his Parrots

To:
Subject: Re: FW: [Birding-Aus] John Young and his Parrots
From: "Evan Beaver" <>
Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 15:08:43 +1000
Who can blame John for keeping his cards close to his chest? From his
point of view, this is my understanding of what has happened:

Spend 30 years or so establishing yourself as a leader in ornithology
and naturalism in Australia.

Move into a rainforest camp for an extended period of time, working
your guts out to determine the status of a fig parrot species.
Photograph a bird you believe to be a new species/sub species of
parrot. Release photos to public. A 'photographic expert' with no
background in birding declares the photos a fraud, and a massive low
pressure system moves into a tea-cup. Every birder in the country
gives their opinion on whether or not he's made the whole thing up and
he decides to keep the rest of the information to himself. It's very
easy to shoot someone down who has a new idea; extremely hard to have
a new idea and the courage to bring it forth. I don't blame John at
all for keeping his cards close to his chest, and would almost
certainly have done the same. At least now we've made certain that
anyone with a new idea will think twice before telling anyone. I just
hope John has the power to overcome the negativity and get on with his
work.

Evan

On 2/21/07, Alistair McKeough <> wrote:
Easy there tiger.

Young's finds have been called into question on the basis of analysis of a
photo by an "expert". Anyone who has spent time in court has seen experts,
including people who legitimately deserve that title, made look silly when
their analysis is tested.

No question at all that the jury is still out for some of us. I have no idea
what to believe myself. But if people want to lodge a subjective vote of
confidence please let them do it without a derogatory reply. Especially when
you can print what you like in Murdoch's rag without risk of being flamed.



On 21/02/07, Roberts, Greg <> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> After everything that has now been put in the public arena, if Tony
> believes that those who have questioned John Young's record have nothing to
> go on other than him "playing things close to his chest'', he is living on a
> different planet to the one I live on.
>
> If there are "dozens'' of birders who agree with him, this is a bigger
> worry than I thought.
>
>
> Greg Roberts
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: 
>  Behalf Of Tony Russell
> Sent: Wednesday, 21 February 2007 9:14 AM
> To: Birds
> Subject: [Birding-Aus] John Young and his Parrots
>
>
>
> I have just re-read the report of John's findings on his website "John
> Young Wildlife Enterprises" to refresh my mind as to what all the
> current fuss is about. I have also reviewed most of the  tittle tattle
> as to John's credibility currently being bandied about on this net.
>
> I must say I find myself shocked and disappointed that there seem to be
> some among us so determined to tarnish the name of such a highly
> regarded naturalist without anything to go on other than the fact that
> he is playing things close to his chest and hasn't yet revealed the full
> details or evidence ( presuming he has some) of his reported find(s).
> Is this suspicion born of envy or yet another example of how we in Oz
> just like to tear down tall poppies?
> Hey, let's give the guy the benefit of the doubt until he deems it
> appropriate to either tell us more or pull his head in and say sorry
> folks, my mistake. Let's stop being so impatient. Even if he backs down
> we shouldn't lose our respect for him.
> My bet is that he's either sitting at home feeling sorry and embarrassed
> at having made a mistake and wondering how he can rescue the situation,
> or he knows he's on safe ground and laughing his head off at all the
> petty nitpicking.
> I don't believe that any amount of badgering is going to get him to
> disclose anything further in public until he is good and ready, so
> instead of insisting that he "put up or shut up" why don't we just shut
> up ourselves and wait for his next revelation, whichever way it goes.
> Don't we owe him enough respect and patience for that? If he is indeed
> on to something good I'm sure we'll hear about it eventually.
> Until he does tell us more all the positive or negative conjecture in
> the world isn't doing any good for anyone, not even those who like the
> sound of their own voices, but least of all for the reputation of
> Australian birders in the rest of the world.
>
> Tony.
>
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--
Evan Beaver
Lapstone, Blue Mountains, NSW
lat=-33.77, lon=150.64
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