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Re: Olympus LS-7 vs LS-11 specs

Subject: Re: Olympus LS-7 vs LS-11 specs
From: "umashankar" umashanks
Date: Sat Jun 4, 2011 9:42 am ((PDT))
thanks klas
=A0
that was needed
=A0
umashankar

i have published my poems. you can read (or buy) at http://stores.lulu.com/=
umashankar

From: Klas Strandberg <>
>To: 
>Sent: Saturday, June 4, 2011 10:02 PM
>Subject: Re: [Nature Recordists] Re: Olympus LS-7 vs LS-11 specs
>
>Thanks Bill, always accurate!
>
>You write:
>
>>This means the LS-11 preamp is 3dBu quieter than the LS-7 under
>>these test conditions.=A0 That's a difference that you will be able to
>>hear in your recordings, but
>
>1: only if you use an external mic that has very low self noise, and
>2: when recording in a space that has a very quiet ambience.
>
>and, I would add, most important:
>
>3: if the external microphone has such a low output voltage / Pa that
>it=B4s signal needs to be amplified a lot by the recorder mic input amplif=
ier.
>
>On the other hand, which is what I suggest, is that there are no such
>low output mikes on the market today. Even a small one dollar
>electret will have an output which is high enough to run over the
>noise of a 110-115 dBu recorder noise.
>
>Some history to spread light on the mic preamp noise as a "holy cow",
>when 1 or 2 db mattered.
>
>In 1975, a typical recording birder in Sweden would buy a Beyer ME80
>to put in his parabol. He chose it because it had a flat freq.
>response, which he was told was "the best". Probably he would have
>preferred to buy a MKH, but he could not afford it. Instead he spent
>the rest of his money on a used Nagra III.
>But the output voltage of ME80 was only 1,5 mV/Pa, which meant that
>the Nagra would have to amplify the signal about 1000 times (60dB) to
>feed the Nagra recording head enough to saturate the tape. Not even
>the Nagra III input was good enough to amplify 60 dB without adding
>"hiss". So, if you wanted "hiss.free" recordings, you had to use a
>big parabol and the bird had to be really close.
>
>Sten Wahlstr=F6m, at the time, found that Sennheiser MD21 gave almost 3
>mV/ Pa and that there was a company in Stockholm making a special
>transformer for it. Using this transformer with the most low noise
>transistor of the time, 1N930, he succeeded in making a preamp that
>performed much better than even the Nagra III.
>
>Those were the times when preamp noise was very important! It was
>"all" as a matter of facts and the biggest challenge for
>naturerecordists struggling with noise / hiss!
>But today is different. Even in the 90-th, you could buy a cheap
>electret which performed almost as good - and better - than the best
>condensor microphones 10 years earlier! Primo made a 10 mm capsule
>called EM60, which - connected to a Nagra III input - provided such a
>high output that what you heard was the mic noise, not the Nagra noise.
>
>To all people asking what recorder to use - go on the price, weight,
>menus, battery life - buy a recorder that you like to use - don't
>sacrifice any such "qualities" for some 3 dBu less input noise.
>
>Klas.
>
>
>At 06:35 2011-06-04, you wrote:
>>Peter,
>>
>>The Avisoft web pages include a tutorial that helps explain what the
>>recorder preamp noise specifications mean.
>>http://www.avisoft.com/tutorial_mic_recorder.htm
>>
>>Consider these specifications only:
>>Olympus LS-11 -122dBu unweighted
>>Olympus LS-7=A0 -118dBu unweighted
>>
>>This means the LS-11 preamp is 3dBu quieter than the LS-7 under
>>these test conditions.=A0 That's a difference that you will be able to
>>hear in your recordings, but only if you use an external mic that
>>has very low self noise, and when recording in a space that has a
>>very quiet ambience.=A0 If you're recording louder sounds, or using a
>>mic with more self noise, the recorder self noise will be masked
>>under most circumstances.
>>
>>Results from pocket recorders almost always can be improved by the
>>use of a good quality external microphone.=A0 For example, Klas
>>Strandberg has introduced a model designed for the Olympus LS-xx
>>models.=A0 http://www.telinga.com/ls10.htm=A0 Unfortunately, you'll need=

>>to spend quite a bit more than the cost of the recorder on such a microph=
one.
>>
>>For the record, neither the LS-11 nor the LS-7 is considered a good
>>solution by itself as a primary field recorder.=A0 These are
>>pocket-size models that best serve as casual recorders note-taking
>>machines.=A0 They can be pressed into service as a primary recorder
>>when you want to travel light, or need a less obtrusive recording kit.
>>
>>If you're looking to make very high quality recordings, none of the
>>pocket recorders is a good solution.=A0 In the less-than-$1000 range,
>>take a look at the Fostex FR-2LE recorder. And expect to pay an
>>additional $1000 to $2000 for microphones, cables, wind screens and
>>mic stands.=A0 Professional gear costs a lot, but delivers superior
>>results, increased durability, and improved ease of use under
>>difficult conditions.
>>
>>Does this mean you can't make an excellent recording with an
>>inexpensive pocket recorder?=A0 No, but the conditions have to be just ri=
ght.
>>
>>Many vendors of recording equipment will allow you to try out a
>>recorder for a few days to see if meets your requirements.=A0 Try
>>several models to see which one works best for you.
>>
>>--oryoki
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>------------------------------------
>>
>>"While a picture is worth a thousand words, a
>>sound is worth a thousand pictures." R. Murray Schafer via Bernie Krause.
>>
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>Telinga Microphones, Botarbo,
>S-748 96 Tobo, Sweden.
>Phone & fax int + 295 310 01
>email: 
>website: www.telinga.com
>=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>"While a picture is worth a thousand words, a
>sound is worth a thousand pictures." R. Murray Schafer via Bernie Krause.
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>








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