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3. Re: reasoning jolly subscriber

Subject: 3. Re: reasoning jolly subscriber
From: "Rob Danielson" danielson_audio
Date: Thu May 29, 2008 11:46 am ((PDT))
Hi Dave--
Thanks for the fieldcraft post guidelines. I look forward to the
pursuing discussion. I'm a bit confused, did you mean to post both of
guideline suggestions on the nature _recording_ list?


Its likely that you'll continue to encounter some do-it-yourself
equipment discussion on this, the nature _recordist_ list. Rob D.

=3D =3D =3D

At 8:58 AM +0100 5/29/08,  wrote:
>We will always be interested in what is used in a specific situation .
>Knowing what mic is usefull to me more say because of the pickup
>response than what make of mic ,
>
>I dont always want to know...
>what it costs, where do I buy them ?, should I buy one? will it work
>with x-y, what is an alternative?, Ive got one and can I build a power
>supply for it ?, how long a cable should I use with it ?,
>
>For me This is where the topic dilutes from the original thread.
>
>I want to know:
>How did you learn about the particular species you were recording ?
>What did you learn in your research about the species ?
>How did you choose the location for the recording ?
>What tactics did you initialy imagine the recording would require ?
>How did you find the species you were recording ?
>Was this task easy ?
>What did you learn in doing so ?
>this could go on for days..........
>
>You may ask why I havent been seen posting such questions... Im slack
>and I dont live in the states and record frogs and toads ( I would love
>to record some in the UK if anyone does such things please answer the
>first 3 questions?! )
>
>seperating the equipment from the practice is usefull to focus
>attention. I find it difficult sometimes to seprate my gear fetish from
>recording excitement. Its sooooo much easier to click buttons on a
>computer than lugging all your gear about and being patient for hours on
>end waiting for a deer to fart. Getting an inch from a deers bum with
>even the noisiest mic and aslong as your levels are good youll get a
>mighty recording.
>
>Lets hope the seperation will help us to focus on recording more and
>getting better recordings.
>
>Dave
>
>Jim Lee wrote:
>>
>>
>>  My $0.02 is that I really hate to see this wonderful group splintered.
>>  This is a huge disappointment to me too. I wish the idea had been
>>  floated to the group for comment before creation of the new group becam=
e
>>  a fait accompli under the direction of our moderator. Such a discussion
>>  might have yielded a different approach.
>>
>>  A hypothetical scenario for the new group: Somebody posts a beautiful
>>  pristine recording. Somebody else is curious about the gear they used t=
o
>>  get the recording. Dare they ask the question? How much detail can they
>>  ask for? Can the respondent elaborate on his/her choices of gear in tha=
t
>>  particular situation? Will comparisons be appropriate? If the recording
>>  is really nice should it be cross posted to the old group or are those
>>  folks just out of luck. If the gear question is interesting, should it
>>  be just left to die in the new group or shared?
>>
>>  I am sure all of this will work itself out but . . . .
>>
>>  Jim Lee
>>
>>  --
>>  Jim Lee - Bamboo Turtle Studio
>>  <http://www.bambooturtle.com>http://www.bambooturtle.com
>><<http://www.bambooturtle.com>http://www.bambooturtle.com>
>>
>>  Home of the Rock Nest Monster
>>
>><http://www.bambooturtle.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html>http://www.bambooturtl=
e.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html
>>
>><<http://www.bambooturtle.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html>http://www.bambooturt=
le.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html>
>>
>>  Greg Simmons wrote:
>>  > My intention is not to offend or ridicule, although the following
>>  > might be interpreted that way...
>>  >
>>  > A) I find it highly disappointing to see information that ought to be
>>  > pooled together as a huge and wonderful resource being split into
>>  > two, purely because some subscribers can't filter it. I get it in
>>  > digest form (as some others do) and find it very easy to scroll or
>>  > otherwise navigate through. There's a list of topics at the top, and
>  > > clicking on any one of those will automatically scroll down to that
>>  > message in the digest. If I want to reply to a message, I simply
>>  > click on the message's title and it takes me to Yahoo Groups. And at
>>  > the end of each message is a 'return to top' line to get me back to
>>  > the contents list at the top. This is far preferable to me than
>>  > receiving invidual messages, many of which I'm not interested in *at
>>  > this point in time* (perhaps later though), and/or logging into Yahoo
>>  > Groups to monitor things - both of which require way too much
>>  > clickety click and navigating around.
>>  >
>>  > I also use Gmail, which has Google's excellent searching
>>  > capabilities, so I have no need to archive or otherwise organise the
>>  > digests at all - they're all stored in my InBox on Gmail's servers
>>  > (of which I'm currently using 3513MB (51%) of my ever-growing 6770MB
>>  > storage capacity). If I want to find a message about recording birds
>>  > on the Tibetan plateau, I simply put in the keywords and tell it to
>>  > search my InBox. Up they come, one after another, in a single list. I
>>  > can't imagine anything easier than digest form messages received in
>>  > Gmail, and I can get that information from any computer on-line,
>>  > anywhere in the world.
>>  >
>>  > B) It's a pity that those who have complained about excessive gear
>>  > talk are motivated enough to complain about it, but not motivated
>>  > enough to redress the situation in a pro-active manner. Rather than
>>  > sitting waiting for someone to ask how to record the unicorn, a
>>  > recognised expert in unicorn recording (c'mon, you know who you are!)
>>  > who felt there was too excessive gear talk could've done a great
>>  > service by initiating a thread titled "How I record unicorns" -
>>  > focusing on their fieldcraft, what worked and what didn't, and
>>  > providing mp3 excerpts of their successes and failures.
>>  >
>>  > Any list ultimately reflects the interests of its subscribers, and it
>>  > is up to the subscribers to steer it where they want by asking
>>  > questions and/or initiating topics to volunteer information. The
>>  > excessive gear talk 'problem' we have here is due to a lot of
>>  > questions being asked about equipment, but not much initiating of
>>  > topics about fieldcraft.
>>  >
>>  > C) Some figures mentioned here lately suggest that there are nearly
>>  > 1500 subscribers to the list, and, to quote: "We have had over 80 new
>>  > subscribers to the new group and 9/10's of them added that it was
>>  > good to get away from excessive gear talk!"
>>  >
>>  > Firstly, 9/10 of "over 80 new subscribers" is somewhere over 72
>>  > people, out of almost 1500 subscribers. That represents about 5% or
>>  > so of the total people here. A significant majority? For about the
>>  > same effort required to sign up to the new group, they could've got
>>  > filters happening, or chosen to get the list sent in digest form, or
>>  > asked someone else to show them how to do it. Instead, we now have
>>  > two groups with the aim of isolating fieldcraft from gear talk, when
>>  > the two ultimately go hand in hand because you can't have one without
>>  > the other.
>>  >
>>  > Secondly, surely the new group is way too young to be making such
>>  > statements about how good it is to get away from excessive gear talk.
>>  > I'll wager that many conversations about fieldcraft will ultimately
>>  > lead to someone asking "wow, what a great recording, what microphone
>>  > (s) did you use and why?", or "wow, that recording is so quiet, what
>>  > preamps did you use and why?" - both of which always lead to
>>  > discussions of technology. What happens then? Does someone break in
>>  > mid-thread and say, "Oi, blasphemers, that's not allowed here, take
>>  > it to the old list"? In 12 months time are we going to see a new
>>  > message saying that the old and new lists are being merged together
>>  > because they're both populated by the same people discussing the same
>>  > things, and some people are finding it hard to keep track of
>>  > conversations that started on the new list but had to move to the old
>>  > list due to excessive gear talk (or vice versa).
>  > >
>>  > D)Technology has changed, recording gear is becoming more affordable
>>  > and amazingly portable, and we have a greater global appreciation of
>>  > the natural environment. As a result of these factors, there are more
>>  > and more people wanting to make nature recordings. Surely this is a
>>  > good thing. Unlike a decade ago, where there wasn't as much
>>  > affordable portable technology to choose from, there is now a
>>  > bewildering range of products. People want to make the right choices
>>  > before they spend their money. Many of them are driven by passion,
>>  > but don't have a technical background so they come here asking for
>>  > help. Discussions of fieldcraft are absolutely fantastic and
>>  > priceless, but without recording equipment they are meaningless -
>>  > there's no point knowing where to put the microphone if you don't
>>  > have one! So it is only natural for people to ask about the gear they
>>  > need (tech talk), before they start discussing how to use it
>>  > (fieldcraft). One leads to another, and it begins with having the
>>  > right gear. As many of the newcomers take advice from here and buy
>>  > their own gear and start making recordings, they'll start asking
>>  > about fieldcraft... And then where do they go?
>>  >
>>  > Apologies in advance if I've put any noses out of joint. I'll be
>>  > joining up to the new group anyway, because I don't want to miss a
>>  > single thing here. Also, with Gmail and digest messages, it will
>>  > probably make no difference except double the amount of incoming
>>  > messages.
>>  >
>>  > Bother...
>>  >
>>  >
>>  > ------------------------------------
>>  >
>>  > "While a picture is worth a thousand words, a
>>  > sound is worth a thousand pictures." R. Murray Schafer via Bernie Kra=
use
>>  > Yahoo! Groups Links
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>  >
>>
>>  --
>>  Jim Lee - Bamboo Turtle Studio
>>  <http://www.bambooturtle.com>http://www.bambooturtle.com
>><<http://www.bambooturtle.com>http://www.bambooturtle.com>
>>
>>  Home of the Rock Nest Monster
>>
>><http://www.bambooturtle.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html>http://www.bambooturtl=
e.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html
>>
>><<http://www.bambooturtle.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html>http://www.bambooturt=
le.us/Rock_Nest_Monster.html>
>>
>>
>
>


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