No, I do agree with you on this point. My only point is that the
sound editors themselves are often not fully to blame. A lot of them,
if they had the time or resources, would probably try harder to do it
right. And I know how much you've contributed just to Skywalker, my
home for the last 8 years, so I know how easy it can be to find the
right stuff. But often nowadays there will be no money in the budget
for any sound effects acquisition, either to go and collect them or
to 'rent' them from people who have them. I spent thousand of dollars
out of my own pocket on the movies I've done recording things that I
want. Very occasionally I get some money back from the budget, most
times not.
And I try my best for accuracy when I can, but have certainly been
guilty of sneaking in a sound that is 'emotionally' correct over on
that is geographically correct, but doesn't fit the emotion of the
scene.
I do think in the larger sense, especially about a project so
centralized to a specific location with a very discernible sound, I
certainly would have tracked down you or Doug Quinn or someone who
has been there and has a library of FX from there, and spent some
money to that end. But also, a few times I've tried to 'rent' sound
effects from some people out there, the prices they were asking were
completely out of line with the reality of a film sound budget. They
see 'hollywood' and see dollar signs. So sometimes there is just no
money, and not many people are willing to give their FX away for free
(nor should they). I once wanted to record some old turn of the
century arcade games for a movie. I found someone who had them. He
was willing to let me record them (and I actually needed about 1
minute of them in the film) for $20,000 and a credit in the film. Um,
sure.
But I've also found lots of people willing to help just to help. And
there are some nice growing resources like www.snapsound.com that if
they catch on, will make tracking down geographically correct sound a
bit easier.
Carroll Ballard's insistence on real sound is admirable, and as you
note, rare. I remember when they were prepping Duma and they were
scouting for someone to go for a couple of weeks down to Africa to
record those FX. And I've tried on several films to get them to
include some money from the beginning to send someone to a location
for recording. It's been vetoed from the budget every time.
I agree that it is very sad, and it certainly extends way beyond
sound effects. There are very few directors left period who honestly
truly seem to 'give a damn' about much of it at all. I've never met a
producer who did.
Sigh. Now I'm depressed.
On Aug 7, 2007, at 7:01 AM, Bernie Krause wrote:
> Mostly laziness, Tim. And profound cynicism (like you say "99%'ll
> never know the difference..." so why try to make
> a difference with our work, right?) I've been working in film
> (writing and ghosting scores and providing EFX since 1963)
> having contributed to over 135 features (on the order of Apocalypse
> Now, Rosemary's Baby, Shipping News,
> Castaway, etc etc etc) and have rarely found directors who had the
> willingness or intellectual curiosity to actually chase down the
> right ambient material. There are a couple of majors =96 the late Robt
> Altman, and Carroll Ballard (Never Cry
> Wolf, Fly Away Home, Duma) =96 and a few lesser directors. But mostly
> you get the "Aw hell, they'll never know
> the difference, anyway" routine. Those aren't the kinds of footprints
> I want to leave on my art when I'm gone. Fact is, people DO
> know the difference. And care.
>
> Within this group there are all kinds of great resources from all
> kinds of great places. Most of these folks are a
> phone call or email away. It takes that much time.
>
> Bernie
>
>
>
> On Aug 6, 2007, at 10:48 PM, Tim Nielsen wrote:
>> And the fact is, 99% or more of the people out there probably
>> would never
>> know the difference (which is also probably a bit sad).
>>
>>
>> Tim
>>
>> On Aug 6, 2007, at 8:37 PM, Bernie Krause wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I don't know how many on the list have seen BLOOD DIAMOND, but with
>>> my wife on the road last night, and the Netflix DVD sitting by
>> itself
>>> on the coffee table and me alone in the house, I put it in the
>>> player. For me, it ain't a good flick. Way too violent in the
>>> episodic Hollywood American sense to be worthwhile no matter what
>> the
>>> "cause." But it was made far worse by the terrible sound editing.
>>> The story takes place in Africa in (sometimes) forested areas where
>>> diamonds are mined. I got as far as the scene where those jerks
>>> inserted a Screaming Piha (Lipaugus vociferans) and tropical South
>>> American frogs and insects as part of the soundscape. It was at that
>>> moment they lost me and I shut the damned thing off. I could no
>>> longer suspend disbelief, having no patience for this kind of
>>> cynicism.
>>>
>>> Bernie
>>>
>>> Wild Sanctuary
>>> POB 536
>>> Glen Ellen, CA 95442
>>> 707-996-6677
>>> http://www.wildsanctuary.com
>>>
>>> Google Earth zooms: Earth.WildSanctuary.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> Wild Sanctuary
> POB 536
> Glen Ellen, CA 95442
> 707-996-6677
> http://www.wildsanctuary.com
>
> Google Earth zooms: Earth.WildSanctuary.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> "While a picture is worth a thousand words, a
> sound is worth a thousand pictures." R. Murray Schafer via Bernie
> Krause
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
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