Hi Jeff,
That is interesting. Actually at one point it was suggested that it was a
juvenile. But I thought that the coverts look too abraded and therefore
suggested that it was an adult in heavy moult. What do you think? I am happy to
be corrected.
Cheers,
Nikolas
----------------
Nikolas Haass
Sydney, NSW
________________________________
From: Jeff Davies <>
To: 'Tony Keene' <>;
Sent: Friday, May 4, 2012 2:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Help with ID on a duck please
I have come late to this, but I notice that nobody has suggested that this bird
is juvenile. Note the dull eye colour, small body feathers and most
significantly the lack of a full set of flight feathers which have just stated
to grow in simultaneously.
So juvenile Grey Teal for mine.
Cheers Jeff.
-----Original Message-----
From:
On Behalf Of Tony Keene
Sent: Friday, 4 May 2012 12:20 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Help with ID on a duck please
I'm on the side of the Grey Tealists - for me, the head is too square, the beak
too short and not quite tapering enough, the neck is not as thin and long in
any of the photos as I would expect. As Ed mentioned, the eye is also the
wrong colour. A major point for me is that while the tail does look pointed,
the pattern of how the feathers are arranged looks wrong - in Northern
Pintails, the central tail feather is clearly longer, while this looks quite
different. I think it's just the lack of flight feathers that's really
accentuating the tail.
Overall, I'd say Grey Teal.
As Nikolas said, hybrids are well-studied in northern ducks, but new and
interesting ones are always popping up as ornamental ducks escape and start
interbreeding. If I wanted to be facetious, I'd ask if there were any
free-roaming Yellow-billed Pintails in the area, as the plumage and tail are a
little similar...
Cheers,
Tony
On 04/05/2012 09:30, Nikolas Haass wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am also one of these Northern Hemispherians, who have seen tens of
> thousands of Northern Pintails in Europe, North America, Africa and Asia.
> Confirming others, neither jizz, plumage colour nor bare part colour "make
> it" a Northern Pintail or any of the other pintails. The jizz clearly
> indicates one of the teals - the only ID contenders are Grey Teal, Sunda Teal
> or Chestnut Teal and - if you want to stretch it - Cape Teal. To me the bird
> still looks like a Grey Teal.
> The infamous "H" word is however not so infamous in Anas, Aythya, Anser and
> Branta. However, most Northern Hemisphere hybrid combinations appear to be
> well-studied and I cannot find any that looks that similar to Grey Teal as
> David's bird. As so often, the Southern Hemisphere is not so well covered in
> many studies. So, I still can't rule out a hybrid 100%. But again, I still
> think it is a Grey Teal.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Nikolas
>
>
> ----------------
> Nikolas Haass
>
> Sydney, NSW
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Robert Inglis<>
> To: Birding-Aus<>
> Sent: Thursday, May 3, 2012 9:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Help with ID on a duck please
>
> With reference to David Taylor’s very interesting question about the
> ‘strange’ duck he saw on the University of Queensland campus out there at
> Gatton in the Lockyer Valley in SE Queensland (an area which was devastated
> by, unprecedented in white man’s time, floods last year) I would like to ask
> a question with the following context in mind.
>
> Although I have been birdwatching for nearly 40 years I have never come to
> grips with moult. Although I have been photographing birds for most of that
> time and some of the most expert people in Australia have been very patiently
> trying to educate me in the understanding of moult I seem to be too dumb (or
> too old) to take it all in. I’m tempted to give those people names but I
> really shouldn't embarrass them so I won’t. But I say to them “Don’t give
> up.” I love youse all.
>
> Anyhow..........
> The question is:
> Why is David Taylor’s ‘strange’ bird not a Northern Pintail female undergoing
> moult of the primaries and, possibly, the secondaries – as has been suggested?
> Is it because it is in Queensland? (Oh, that is facetious, Bob and should be
> struck from the records).
>
> I have not yet seen a pintail of any description so I am clutching at straws
> here but I have consulted “Wildfowl” by Steve Madge and Hilary Burn as well
> as HANZAB (we all know what that is, don’t we?). Having done so it seems to
> me that there is a possibility, small though it might be, that David, et all,
> has found something very ‘interesting’.
>
> Why isn’t David’s bird a Northern Pintail female undergoing moult of the
> primaries and, as it has been suggested, the secondaries?
>
> In asking this question, I am hoping that those birders who have had
> extensive experience with observing Northern Pintails will respond. After
> all, the majority of Australian birdwatchers with experience of northern
> hemisphere birds come from...............the northern hemisphere. At least
> that is my observation. A few Australian boundary-ed birdwatchers probably
> only see one or two Northern Pintails in their entire life. As I said, I
> haven’t seen any and I confine my observations to the mainland of Australia.
>
> I realize the shortcomings of digital photography (having been involved with
> it for 11 years) and therefore I understand why David’s images vary in the
> colours of the plumage of this bird but, understanding those technicalities,
> I can see, as David saw, that this bird is ‘different’ to the average Grey
> Teal. My initial reaction was that it is always wise to not look for a rarity
> and to simply look for an aberration when observing something which looks
> ‘different’. My experience at that location is that the common ducks include
> Grey Teal so that is what I initially advised David . However, further
> consideration encouraged me to suggest that this bird might, only might, be
> something else.
> As I read it, David’s bird might have a rufous wash over the head and the
> iris might be somewhat different in colour to that of Grey Teal. If so that
> could indicate Northern Pintail female.
> Not Northern Pintail juvenile as the plumage is quite different.
>
> In the course of education (of me in particular) I would like those birders
> who have had experience with Northern Pintail females (from an observer’s
> point of view) to come forward and voice an opinion.
> Is that too much to ask?
>
> Please understand that I am not being critical of anyone but simply wanting
> to ensure that an opportunity is not missed.
> I don’t mind if I am proven to be way of track here.
>
> A ‘proverb’ from the latest book I am reading “In advising a friend,
> seek to help, not please”. (The good Book – a secular bible- by AC
> Grayling)
>
> Bob Inglis
> Sandstone Point
> Qld
> http://www.photos-n-guides.com/ (my new and expanded website – still a
> work in progress so please forgive the errors and omissions)
>
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