Good morning all,
Do we have any idea of how many of each group i.e. hunters and birders, there
are?
Sonja
On 27/03/2013, at 8:47 PM, Chris Sanderson wrote:
> Thanks Nick for providing some balance to the argument! I certainly know
> some conservation-minded shooters who are no doubt cringing at this news.
> In fact I think probably many shooters are reading these news articles and
> thinking "you buggers are ruining it for the rest of us". At least I hope
> they are, because peer pressure is likely to be far more effective than
> pester-power in achieving improvements in hunting behaviour. I'm not
> certain the bad behaviour of birders (which undoubtedly happens and is
> likely more common than we'd like to think) is comparable to the senseless
> slaughter of hundreds of protected birds though. Perhaps egg collecting or
> poaching would be a better counter-example, as no doubt there have been
> people interested in birds and bird-watching who have strayed down that
> path in the past.
>
> I do know that polarising this issue puts us on the losing side, as there
> are many, many more hunters than birders, and while this is a political
> issue that means we can't win. Perhaps considering Nick's idea of talking
> to the hunting lobby as equals with a vested interest in conservation has
> some merit?
>
> Cheers,
> Chris
>
> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 8:08 PM, David Richardson <
>> wrote:
>
>> Well written Mr Leseberg.Food for thought.
>>
>> D. Richardson.
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 27, 2013 at 4:15 PM, Nick Leseberg <
>>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Dear Sonja et al,
>>>
>>> I think we as birders need to be very careful how we approach this
>>> particular event. The broad statement that "I don't think shooters would
>>> consider it a waste or mindless" is unhelpful and attempts to tar all
>>> shooters with the same brush. There are many responsible shooters out
>> there
>>> who are very aware of the rules applied to regulate their chosen pastime,
>>> and who abide by those rules. There are plenty of birders who disregard
>> or
>>> blatantly flout the rules associated with our pastime, approaching nests
>>> too closely (see the recent thread concerning the nesting Red Goshawks at
>>> Mataranka), using excessive playback when photographing birds etc, but
>>> there is no suggestion that birding should be banned. Likewise there are
>>> hunters who will disregard or blatantly flout the rules pertaining to
>>> hunting. As birders and people generally concerned for the environment,
>> we
>>> must be sure to direct our efforts at ensuring the rules that exist are
>>> enforced and that those who flout them are puni
>>> shed accordingly, rather than simply decrying the existence of duck
>>> shooters as a fraternity, because one or even a minority of duckshooters
>>> broke the rules.
>>>
>>> This raises the follow-on question of whether the rules and regulations
>>> which apply to hunting are adequate, an issue for which there is no easy
>>> answer. Several species of duck are not endangered and could quite easily
>>> sustain a level of harvesting that would not affect their population.
>> Just
>>> as there is a program for management of macropod populations in some
>> rural
>>> areas, a program whereby people are permitted to sustainably hunt certain
>>> duck species is unlikely to have any significant effects on the
>> populations
>>> of those species. If such a program is effectively managed and policed I
>>> can only see benefits. What if the money raised from such a program was
>> put
>>> towards the conservation of sensitive wetlands, as occurs in the United
>>> States where the hunting lobby is also a very effective conservation
>> group?
>>> I have often wondered why organisations which ultimately have similar
>> goals
>>> are not able to unite in some way to further both their interests.
>>>
>>> If the issue is that shooting ducks is inhumane due to the probability
>>> that birds will be left wounded, then we should make this clear also. Is
>>> there possibly a balance that can be reached here? What if those rules
>> and
>>> regulations that try to mitigate these problems can be better enforced,
>>> perhaps with the help of conservation volunteers? Would that satisfy
>>> organisations like the Coalition Against Duck Shooting? Could the
>>> organisations on both sides of this argument meet at some level to come
>> up
>>> with an accord where they agree to disagree on some issues, but also
>> commit
>>> to working together to solve other problems and also advance the causes
>> of
>>> both organisations on issues such as wetland conservation, shooter/birder
>>> education etc.
>>>
>>> So, before the hate mail starts rolling in, I want to make it clear that
>>> my intention here is not to defend duck shooting. The incident that
>>> occurred in NW Vic was abhorrent and we as bird lovers should voice our
>>> disgust and ensure that the perpetrator(s) feel the full weight of the
>> law.
>>> When looking at the bigger picture though, we need to be articulate and
>>> direct about what our issues are. If we have a particular problem with
>> duck
>>> hunting we need to make that clear, and we also need to ensure we can
>>> justify why it is a problem and how this problem can be solved. Broad
>> brush
>>> statements such as "duck shooters are murdering innocent wildlife and
>>> should be stopped" are not helpful, and simply force the opposing groups
>>> further apart. In reality, the abolition of duck hunting in Victoria (and
>>> perhaps looking further ahead, NSW) doesn't seem to be an option, so
>> let's
>>> think outside the box and be creative in coming up with ways we can
>>> approach this problem and get a better outcome
>>> for all involved.
>>>
>>> Regards and good birding (as he boards up his windows and doors, and
>> turns
>>> off his phone and email!!)
>>>
>>> Nick Leseberg
>>>
>>>
>>>
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