Shy Albatross x 2 on offer

To: "Philip Veerman" <>, "Allan Richardson" <>
Subject: Shy Albatross x 2 on offer
From: "" <>
Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2014 14:12:17 +1100
No denying what you are saying Philip about the scientific merit of collecting 
dead organisms, but from a National Park as was stated.... That's a whole 
different kettle of seafood, regardless of permits.

My suggestion is to let the rangers or museum know and they can collect the 
specimens if they desire.

Collecting bird bands off dead specimens is much easier.

John Harris

----- Reply message -----
From: "Philip Veerman" <>
To: "'Allan Richardson'" <>, "'John Harris'" 
Cc: "'Birding-Aus'" <>
Subject: Shy Albatross x 2 on offer
Date: Tue, Jan 7, 2014 13:41

Presumably in most cases "disposed of correctly" is to leave it just to
nature, given legalistic concerns about collecting without a permit. But if
the specimen is of some value, then I don't agree. How difficult is it to
get a permit? I have had such a permit for nearly 30 years. Whilst John's
advice is technically correct, it would be a rare case of a prosecution from
something like collecting a skeleton. Fauna protection enforcement
bureaucracies surely have higher priorities than this. I ask has anyone ever
heard of such an agency prosecuting someone who legitimately takes an
already dead specimen of fauna to donate to a museum or similar (and what
was the result). Some specimens found dead provide important material to
document vagrant records or simply provide an increase in sample size of
data or range of specimens so that museum staff don't need to go collecting
as much. Collecting specimens like this can provide material that is useful
to study anatomy, is useful as reference material for artwork (getting
proportions right, collecting representative feathers etc) as well as other
reasons such as assessing cause of death. Or it can just promote an interest
in biology.


-----Original Message-----
From: Birding-Aus  On Behalf Of
Allan Richardson
Sent: Tuesday, 7 January 2014 12:17 PM
To: John Harris
Cc: Birding-Aus
Subject: Shy Albatross x 2 on offer

Hi Barbara,

John is correct, so be very careful how you proceed with the possession of
these birds or taking any birds into your possession in the future.

However I think you've done the right thing in alerting a forum that has
members with the sort of qualifications that John mentions and data from
deceased individuals can give valuable information about bird movements in
some cases. 

Shy albatross records and measurements in particular, due to recent
taxonomic changes, could be of great interest to the seabird scientific
fraternity at the moment.

You might contact SOSSA directly perhaps (internet will give contact
details) or the Australian Museum to find out how these birds might be
documented and disposed of correctly.

Kind regards,

Allan Richardson
Morisset NSW

On 06/01/2014, at 3:59 PM, John Harris wrote:

> Beware,
> they are protected and having them in your possession without the
> appropriate permits to collect and or keep, could lead to fines!!
> *Yours in all things* "*GREEN"*
> *John Harris*
> *Croydon, Vic*
> * Director - Wildlife Experiences Pty LtdPrincipal
> Ecologist/Zoologist* *Nature Photographer* *Wildlife Guide*
>  <>*
> *0409090955*
> *President, Field Naturalists Club of Victoria* *(
> <>)*
> On 6 January 2014 15:56, Barbara Jones <>
> wrote:
>> Is there anyone wanting Shy Albatross x 2 for skeletons?
>> One found yesterday on Middle Beach, Mimosa Rocks NP (Far South Coast
>> NSW) and dragged up beyond high tide and another on Aragunnu, a tad 
>> further north still there from before Christmas.
>> Directions available for anyone interested.
>> Barbara Jones _______________________________________________
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