canberrabirds
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To: | "'martin butterfield'" <>, "'Tony Lawson'" <> |
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Subject: | "First Bird" Fossil, Archaeopteryx, More Closely Related to Dinosaurs |
From: | "Philip Veerman" <> |
Date: | Tue, 2 Aug 2011 14:25:21 +1000 |
Curious. That implies that what has happened in prehistory is
strangely somehow influenced by what someone believes. It is hard to imagine how
the nature of a person's thought process in the 21 century could maybe change
what has happened.
What
if I believe in the rainbow serpent or that geese change into barnacles every
year? The idea that they were
all created at exactly the same instant is only one of many culturally
induced suggestions (not the only alternative automatic to evolution as Martin
suggests) and no reason to think that one is any better than others. Sadly for
that idea, there is nothing in the fossil record consistent with the idea that
they were all created at
exactly the same instant.
Another idea is that if dinosaurs were alive today, that birds would
simply be classified as another order within the class of vertebrates, most of
which are dinosaurs and the difference between them is really not so great.
Because birds are mostly comparatively small and delicate, there are not many
fossils showing that important period. As more fossils are found, we may
understand the process better and the dividing line will become harder to
place.
I
wonder what Urvogel
means, certainly vogel (in German & Dutch) simply means bird but what
does ur mean? Is it a precursor of that awful brand of lazy grammar horror of
kids' SMS text speak for "you are"? As in "You are bird"?
Of
course Archaeopteryx is ancient wing and
not an English word.
Philip
-----Original Message----- Tony asked "What is now the first bird?".
From: martin butterfield [ Sent: Tuesday, 2 August 2011 8:09 AM To: Tony Lawson Cc: Canberra Birds Subject: Re: [canberrabirds] "First Bird" Fossil, Archaeopteryx, More Closely Related to Dinosaurs I have two answers to this. If one believes that evolution is an analogue process with many infinitesimally small differences over small periods of time the answer is "unknowable". As long as palaeontologists are promoted on the basis of number of published papers there will always be debate as to exactly where to draw the line defining where something ceased to be a dinosaur and became a bird. On the other hand if one doesn't believe in evolution the answer is "All of them" as they were all created at exactly the same instant. It is interesting to read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeopteryx. There appear to have been only 11 fossils of Archaeopteryx ever found, so the sample sizes are not great! (Incidentally this must be one of the very few cases in which a German name - Urvogel - is shorter and easier to spell than the usual name in English.) Martin On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:41 AM, Tony Lawson <>
wrote:
Yet another account - if you'r not sick of them by now - & Geoffrey, in my view it reads pretty well. |
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