birding-aus

Winton, QLD

To: "mike.honeyman" <>
Subject: Winton, QLD
From: Denise Goodfellow <>
Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2018 13:07:17 +0930
The other reason my friend gave for restricting access to the SP was the 
behaviour of certain birders who not only took risks re crocodiles etc, but 
were present without a permit.  He threatened to have them arrested.


On 10 Aug 2018, at 12:29 pm, mike.honeyman <> wrote:

> And general health and safety risks and liabilities around open water, human 
> health risks (wastewater), drinking water contamination risks (dams), 
> unintentional interference with operations and so on and so on....
> Speaking from personal experience most water utilities would be happy to take 
> the 'greenie points' of having facilities as an environmental and community 
> benefit, but please try and have some sympathy with the difficulties often 
> presented to acheiving this which is after all a 'nice to have', not a core 
> function.
> 
> 
> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.
> -------- Original message --------From: Denise Goodfellow 
> <> Date: 10/8/18  12:41 pm  (GMT+10:00) To: Martin 
> Butterfield <> Cc: Graeme Stevens <>, 
> birding-aus <>, Michael Honeyman 
> <> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Winton, QLD 
> I know.  According to a senior public servant one reason why access to 
> facilities up here such as sewage ponds and Darwin River Dam is now so 
> difficult  is crocodiles.  Another is a fear of terrorism.   
> 
> Denise 
> On 10 Aug 2018, at 9:36 am, Martin Butterfield <> wrote:
> Its not just in the US.  Some councils in NSW (I'm thinking of Lake 
> Cargelligo as the best example) who promote their used-water facilities as 
> birding sites and get a lot of people staying in their caravan sites and 
> spending $$ in the towns.  Others Councils, including the equivalent mob 
> responsible for the ACT, seem blinkered in their consideration of more than 
> one use for these sites
> Martin Butterfieldhttp://franmart.blogspot.com.au/
> 
> 
> On 10 August 2018 at 07:28, Denise Goodfellow <> 
> wrote:
> Graeme, couldn’t agree more.  But such attitudes towards birders are not 
> surprising.  A couple of decades ago I put it to councils around the NT that 
> birders are a market they should target.  In North America birding has been 
> the saviour of the economy of some small towns.  There is still little 
> interest as I found when I put it to both the mayors of my shire and Tennant 
> Creek.
> Here, by the way, I’m not just talking listers.  Most birders have a wide 
> range of interests, and many are travelling with a spouse as well.  
> Denise
> 
> 
> On 10 Aug 2018, at 6:31 am, Graeme Stevens <> wrote:
> Also my line Denise:
> Very polite advice on the power of this medium to spread the word and the 
> risk of a "Birding and grey nomad" bypass as they give Winton a "why bother" 
> just at the time when the severe drought needs visitors to support local 
> businesses.
> Perhaps they have so many visitors stocking up before chasing Night Parrots 
> that the don't really care?
> Graeme S
> 
> 
> From: Denise Goodfellow <>
> Sent: Friday, 10 August 2018 6:23 AM
> To: Martin Butterfield
> Cc: Graeme Stevens; birding-aus; Michael Honeyman
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Winton, QLD I’m an ex-alderman (Darwin City 
> Council) and know that this is the case for many issues.  Which is why I took 
> the tourism angle.  
> Denise
> 
> On 10 Aug 2018, at 5:28 am, Martin Butterfield <> wrote:
> Welcome to the world of Local Government!  What would get the Council's
> attention would be complaints from residents - preferably ones who pay a
> lot of rates - of the area.  Outsiders jumping up and down can be safely
> ignored.
> 
> Martin Butterfield
> http://franmart.blogspot.com.au/
> 
> On 9 August 2018 at 21:52, Graeme Stevens <> wrote:
> 
> And no response to email.
> 
> Graeme Stevens
> 
> 
> ________________________________
> From: Birding-Aus <> on behalf of Greg
> and Val Clancy <>
> Sent: Thursday, 9 August 2018 8:10 PM
> To: Michael Honeyman; Peter Shute
> Cc: 
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Winton, QLD
> 
> I agree that we shouldn’t 'shoot from the hip' but I am still awaiting a
> response from the Director of Works who promised to call me back days ago.
> I have followed up but to no avail. Not a good look.
> 
> Greg Clancy
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Honeyman
> Sent: Wednesday, August 8, 2018 10:27 PM
> To: Peter Shute
> Cc: 
> Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Winton, QLD
> 
> Very much depends on the site Peter!
> 
> And to an extent also depends on who you ask. I’ve worked on jobs where
> previous advice given was along the lines of ‘fill it all in and build a
> big
> automated plant’ and been able to recommend minor changes that kept the
> lagoons in situ with minor modifications.
> 
> That said vegetation to any significant degree usually risks the integrity
> of the lining of the pond, and whether 500 rhizomes or 250 rhizomes are
> starting to penetrate the liner is academic - they all have to come out to
> protect the liner.
> 
> Another factor is that ponds (usually over many years) accumulate sludge as
> part of the way they operate and this needs to be periodically dug out one
> way or another. If the reeds are growing in the sludge then again, they
> have
> to come out.
> 
> This is all speculation on my part of course, just trying to give some
> context as someone experienced in the design and operation of treatment
> lagoons before the birding community shoots from the hip at too many
> council
> employees. In the unique situation of being both qualified as an engineer
> and qualified as an ornithologist!
> 
> mjh
> 
> On 8 Aug 2018, at 20:52, Peter Shute <> wrote:
> 
> Are compromises feasible, Mike? Eg just remove half the reeds?
> 
> Peter Shute
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 8 Aug 2018, at 6:47 am, mike.honeyman <>
> wrote:
> 
> Hi allThere is mention of the 'old' treatment ponds, was this a current
> active treatment plant?
> Excessive vegetation in treatment lagoons is not condusive to their
> primary purpose - treating sewage - so if they were active lagoons there
> may have been a need to have removed the veg to ensure it was working
> effectively.I'm not personally familiar with this site, but have
> consulted on other sites where the lagoons had reeds encroaching and the
> reeds have generally had to go, birds or not.
> mjh
> null
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