Hi Chris,
Unfortunately not, if I did, the list would know. If there were no
birders who trespassed, why the sudden ban on birders entering. Come
to that, is there a ban on birders on the traditional lands, or does
it only exist on B-A. Unfortunately there has not been any input to
this discussion from relevant Aboriginal bodies, so all we are getting
appears to be second or third hand. I think it might be time some-one
contacted a body such as the Central Lands Council and ask them for
their side of the storyand ask if they would allow their response to
be posted on B-A. Then we can set about mending fences. I intend to
email the CLC today and ask for their response.
Hopefully we birders will be able to bring about a win-win solution
after all and have some kind of protocol in place which will allow
some of us to catch the next Princess Parrot or even better a Night
Parrot irruption.
Cheers,
Carl Clifford
On 05/10/2010, at 12:25 PM, Chris wrote:
Hi Carl,
I'm not aware of any birders who went out onto Aboriginal land without
permission? Have you heard something concrete that suggests
otherwise? The original birders that went out had permits and explicit
permission from the TOs. As far as I'm aware once permit applications
were rejected people made other plans and respected the system,
despite disappointment.
Perhaps the author for the article chose their words poorly (I haven't
read it yet, I'm out birding) however I think the suggestion that some
adaptability on the part of the CLC and the TOs at the time could have
led to a win - win situation for all concerned is a reasonable one. I
for one would have happily paid $100 for permission to travel the 15km
up the road needed to see the birds instead of dipping.
Regards,
Chris
Sent from my iPhone
On 05/10/2010, at 10:56, Carl Clifford <> wrote:
Simon,
Birders are "banned" from entering all private property, unless
invited or otherwise, by the owners. This whole situation has
stemmed from birders entering private property without invitation.
Lets be honest, those birders perpetrated a crime, trespass on
private lands. It is no different than if a bunch of strangers set
up camp in ones back yard. Bigger back yard, same principle. I know
what I would do if I found some-one camped in my back yard.
I think the traditional owners have behaved in a restrained manner
and hopefully over time a protocol can be worked out for speedier
processing of permits for entering Aboriginal lands. Unfortunately,
we, as birders, now have a bit of lost ground to regain in the
process.
Carl Clifford
On 05/10/2010, at 9:34 AM, Simon Mustoe wrote:
If there are connotations of racism or 'blame' in this article, I
guess it's got nothing to do with birding or birders. So putting
those other matters aside and just looking at it's mention that the
indigenous community has lost out - isn't this interesting to birders?
Since the Princess Parrot debacle, this is the first time that
anyone in the Australian media has questioned whether banning
birders outright was actually the best option. That would seem to
me, to be a very reasonable hypothesis. So on that point, I think
this should be of interest to birders and at least someone has had
the gumption to mention it.
Remember, this article was written by a journalist ... not by Bird-O
- so don't shoot the messenger ; ) ... this is me ducking!
All the best,
Simon.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Simon Mustoe
Tel: +61 (0) 405220830 | Skype simonmustoe | Email
Visit BIRD-O at http://www.bird-o.com
Follow BIRD-O on Twitter http://www.twitter.com/birdodotcom
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pages/Bird-O/117732794921095
Email BIRD-O at
Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2010 07:31:15 +0930
Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Ashmore Reef information
From:
To: ; ;
If the NT News really wanted a more accurate target they should be
looking
towards the government department that helped sink my relatives'
tourism
project on Baby Dreaming. For example, elders were told (as was I)
that
they needed a "Certificate 4 in training" (cost - several thousand
dollars
for each person), to teach particular skills to others.
Also, a Scandinavian birding tour operator offered the community a
donation
of a couple of thousand dollars to train residents to show visitors
sandstone birds. My relatives were very excited. But the money
had to go
through a birding or conservation organisation. A Birds Australia
spokesman
told me it was 'too little' to be worth their while. And then
there's the
debacle of the latest effort to train Indigenous bird guides in
Kakadu.
There's plenty of blame to go around, but very little of it should be
directed at Aboriginal people.
Denise
on 5/10/10 7:15 AM, Bill Stent at wrote:
Simon, I'm not sure that "useful" is quite the word that I'd use
to describe
the NT News article.
"Racist" might be closer. Possibly "patronising" if I were
feeling more
conciliatory.
Not a good hook to get readers to Bird-o.
Bill
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Simon Mustoe" <>
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 8:28 AM
To: <>
Subject: [Birding-Aus] Ashmore Reef information
Hi,
ASHMORE REEF
Ashmore reef trips are nearly upon us so we've put together
information
for you, on this remarkable place. If you visit Bird-O and go to
"Birding
REGIONS" in the top menu, you'll find access to a page about
Ashmore Reef
and the NW Shelf. You can see images from past trips, read about
its
history and the birds that have been seen there. There's also new
article
which summarises the birding highlights from the last 14 trips and
information on how you can plan your trip to Ashmore Reef next
year.
CENTRAL AUSTRALIA
There's another regional page set up for Central Aus. This is a
way to
support our growing birding tour industry so email us if you're
interested
in being part.
OUTBACK HAS UNSEEN BUCKS
Also of interest, an article in NT News titled "Outback has Unseen
Bucks" - a useful follow-up to the recent Princess Parrot debarcle.
http://search.twitter.com/search.atom?q=%23birdonews
To keep updated with this news, follow us on Twitter, Facebook or
sign up
for the newsletter.
Happy birding!
Simon.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Simon Mustoe
Tel: +61 (0) 405220830 | Skype simonmustoe | Email
Visit BIRD-O at http://www.bird-o.com
Follow BIRD-O on Twitter http://www.twitter.com/birdodotcom
Like BIRD-O on Facebook? Visit
http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/pages/Bird-O/117732794921095
Email BIRD-O at
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